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BYU and the Big 12

HFCS said:
As an ISU fan, I wish we had the football tradition, national fan following and national recognition that BYU football has.

If you can't see that you're the one trying to bend things. I doubt you could find any non-ISU fan that thought ISU had similar history/fanbase/brand recognition in football as BYU.
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How often do you walk down the street and see someone sporting BYU clothing? Roughly never. BYU's "national following" I'm beginning to think is a fallocy cooked up by Cyclone fans to justify adding them to the Big 12 (10). BYU isn't even CLOSE to the schools I mentioned in the last post.

And anyone that thinks ISU's history compares to BYU's is a moron. I never once said Iowa State has the history of BYU, but I still haven't seen someone that can show they have any kind of national following. Their budget is even smaller than ISU's.
 
HFCS said:
As an ISU fan, I wish we had the football tradition, national fan following and national recognition that BYU football has.

If you can't see that you're the one trying to bend things. I doubt you could find any non-ISU fan that thought ISU had similar history/fanbase/brand recognition in football as BYU.
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BYU does have somewhat of a built in advantage over us in the fanbase area.
 
Ace000087 said:
Tell me that you wouldn't want to play a game there. 52,500 seat stadium, in the middle of the Rockies. AFA would be a good add for the Big12 North.

And BYU:
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You found the biggest picture on the internet I'm pretty sure. And when the hell did "wanting to play in a stadium" constitute value to a conference? Fact remains: BYU and Air Force, who both have athletics budgets even lower than Iowa State, take more away than they add. Neither of them is top dog in their own state, much like Iowa State. The Big 10 is a powerful conference because they have the top universities in their respective states.
 
IcSyU said:
How often do you walk down the street and see someone sporting BYU clothing? Roughly never. BYU's "national following" I'm beginning to think is a fallocy cooked up by Cyclone fans to justify adding them to the Big 12 (10). BYU isn't even CLOSE to the schools I mentioned in the last post.

And anyone that thinks ISU's history compares to BYU's is a moron. I never once said Iowa State has the history of BYU, but I still haven't seen someone that can show they have any kind of national following. Their budget is even smaller than ISU's.
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Are you for real? ISU's budget would be a lot smaller if we weren't in the Big 12. The fact that BYU has been a consistent top 25 team without ever being in a major conference says something. Actually I know people in several cities who are BYU and Utah Jazz fans, the reason is pretty obvious and it's been touched on by others.

Do you think ISU would be relevant AT ALL if we'd been in Conference USA or something similar for the last 2-3 decades?

Look I'm agreeing with you on AFA, but if I were in charge I'd have reached out to BYU years ago. Especially given the idea that the Pac Ten wanted Utah but not BYU. Of all the non-BCS non-ND schools they were by far the two that deserved BCS status in every way.
 
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snowcraig2.0 said:
If Beebe has not reached out to BYU he should be fired, immediately.
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I agree. It's comical to read the posts dismissing BYU. They averaged 64,200 - 27th in the nation - in football attendance last year, in a conference that had a pitiful average of 33,000 (that's with BYU factored in). ISU averaged almost 20,000 less - 46,000. And some are looking down on BYU?
Give me a break.
 
Tornado man said:
I agree. It's comical to read the posts dismissing BYU. They averaged 64,200 - 27th in the nation - in football attendance last year, in a conference that had a pitiful average of 33,000 (that's with BYU factored in). ISU averaged almost 20,000 less - 46,000. And some are looking down on BYU?
Give me a break.
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They are ranked practically every year too. They've been more competitive than Colorado and as competitive as Nebraska for almost a decade now, and it's not like the last decade was a flash in the pan, their success goes back a long ways.

Utah's population is greater than Nebraska's not much below Colorado's. I'm not buying this sudden "national fan base" of Nebraska. I live in Big Ten country (Chicago), I know 5 people from Nebraska here, 3 of which are fans. Now "national recognition" sure... the Huskers are known by all football fans. BYU isn't quite as historic, but they'd still be known as having more football tradition than the entire remaining Big 12 North and half of the South.
 
IcSyU said:
You found the biggest picture on the internet I'm pretty sure. And when the hell did "wanting to play in a stadium" constitute value to a conference? Fact remains: BYU and Air Force, who both have athletics budgets even lower than Iowa State, take more away than they add. Neither of them is top dog in their own state, much like Iowa State. The Big 10 is a powerful conference because they have the top universities in their respective states.
Click to expand...

You found the biggest picture on the internet I'm pretty sure. And when the hell did "wanting to play in a stadium" constitute value to a conference? Fact remains: BYU and Air Force, who both have athletics budgets even lower than Iowa State, take more away than they add. Neither of them is top dog in their own state, much like Iowa State. The Big 10 is a powerful conference because they have the top universities in their respective states.
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All right, I'll play along.

BYU

110,000 Population, 43 miles south of Salt Lake City (over 1 Million people)
33,000 students
64,000 seat stadium
494-372-26 Record All Time
28 Bowl Games
23 Conference Championships
1 National Championship
1 Heisman Trophy Winner
MITT ROMNEY. STEVE YOUNG.


Air Force:

626,000 Population in Colorado Springs, 61 miles from Denver (2.5 Million People)
5,000 Cadets
52,500 seat stadium
328-274-13 Record All Time
20 Bowl Games
3 Conference Championships
I think the big selling point for them is having a service academy in our conference.

That said, both of those schools have had more success than even Iowa State. Looking out in the Big12 "region" there are not many options, but I would think these 2 should get a serious look when expanding to add 2 more NORTH (the key here) schools.
 
There's a big, big dif between BYU and Air Force. AF would not field competitive teams in many sports, and would drain money from the conference.
 
There's a big, big dif between BYU and Air Force. AF would not field competitive teams in many sports, and would drain money from the conference.
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So, BYU is good. Who would also be a good North team? Colorado State? Wyoming? Memphis? Louisville? Cincinnati?
 
IcSyU said:
CSU: No.
Wyoming: Hell no.
Memphis: See Wyoming.
Louisville: Better than the above, still not a great option.
Cincy: See Louisville.
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There is no great 12th team likely to be available. BYU is a great 11th team.

That's why I (and others) say add BYU and stay at 11 for now. If a reason comes up that you really need a 12th team to keep up then look at these other teams that have various issues.

I'm also not sure BYU is the #2 team in that market either, I think the fan base is pretty evenly split. Utah has been amazing lately, but BYU has had more football success historically. I believe their stadium is larger and their attendance #s are higher than Utah's. They will want to keep up, especially if Utah wins a Pac 12 championship while USC is down... not unlikely btw. BYU will either look to go higher profile independent or join the Big 12. MWC as BCS had a chance but is now shot with Utah gone.

You have to look out for #1. I don't think Beebe or the Big 12 are doing this, they're looking out for Texas. If we had a commish who was really looking out for the well being of the entire conference, BYU would have joined the instant Colorado left because it would have been in the works for quite a while. If Beebe or the Big 12 were looking out for the entire conference CU and Neb may still be here anyway and the point is moot.
 
Have to admit I'm not much of a fan of having BYU in the conference.
-Long travel distance
-Different time zone
-Can't have Big XII championships on Sunday
-Have to compete against older athletes

If the Pac-10 didn't want them, why should the Big XII.
 
LivntheCyLife said:
Have to admit I'm not much of a fan of having BYU in the conference.
-Long travel distance
-Different time zone
-Can't have Big XII championships on Sunday
-Have to compete against older athletes

If the Pac-10 didn't want them, why should the Big XII.
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Good points and my take:

Utah was the best non-BCS school available anywhere, I think Utah/BYU would have been attractive competitively for the Pac Ten but didn't expand the footprint, it would expand the Big 12 footprint. Both of these schools were BCS type schools left out of a BCS conference by mere chance and geography. Now there's only one other than Notre Dame.

The Pac 10 had issues adding a private, conservative, religious school. The Big 12 does not.

Travel for BYU would be similar to what they did in the MWC, and much better than what they had in the old WAC.

Travel for other schools would be only slightly further than Colorado. Time zone is the same as Colorado as well.

Your point about older athletes is well taken, it's likely a reason they've been able to stay a top 25 program for so long without playing in a major conference.

Simply put, they just offer a ton more than any other school that would be likely to join the Big 12 in the near future. Especially now that we know it is 100% about football since the school that basically invented basketball was shown they are nearly irrelevant in conference alignment matters (KU).
 
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BYU is a no brainer. It probably wont happen until next summer at the earliest... if it ever does happen.

IF the B12 wanted to get back to 12 teams, Louisville is the best choice. Even so, I'm pretty blah on Louisville.
 
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