UNI's Superbowl??

[tester]

Hey, all I want is for ISU to be successful. I think that it's a valid point that UNI being good hurts ISU's walk-on program, therefore hurting our overall FB program. I want for UNI NOT to be a viable option for the players we're recruiting (in FB and MBB). So why give them money? Why help them out? ISU is NOT in the position to dole out charity. Give some other 1AA school the payday (like NDSU or SDSU) and put UNI in the budget crunch. That may seem cut-throat, but that's the world we're in with D1 athletics. And it looks like the schedule makers at ISU agree.

How is not playing UNI going to hurt UNI financially? UNI takes a relatively low payday from ISU compared to what many BCS teams pay FCS teams. I'm assuming UNI accepts the lower pay day because of the low travel costs to ISU (bus vs. air). It's also an easy one for their fans to attend. If they don't play ISU they will play somewhere else and probably get a bigger pay day.

ISU would probably have to pay more for a different quality FCS team and probably not have as good of a crowd.

 

[bmuff]

I call bullcrap.

I know a significant number of ISU fans that went because it was UNI. Many went with some of their UNI friends.

You change that game to NDSU or someone like 'em and we're looking at very similar attendance as we had for Toledo and UNLV.

Call it what you want. I personally do not know any fans who were excited to go see UNI specifically. Most would have attended no matter who ISU was playing that day. And if that IS the case with some fans, then they are not that good of fans. I'd MUCH rather see ISU play a Toledo or a UNLV. From what I remember, the UNLV crowd wasn't that bad...the Toledo crowd was definitely hurt from it being on Thursday night though.

Don't worry, I don't have to make the decision to quit playing UNI. The decision has already been made.

 

[bmuff]

How is not playing UNI going to hurt UNI financially? UNI takes a relatively low payday from ISU compared to what many BCS teams pay FCS teams. I'm assuming UNI accepts the lower pay day because of the low travel costs to ISU (bus vs. air). It's also an easy one for their fans to attend. If they don't play ISU they will play somewhere else and probably get a bigger pay day.

ISU would probably have to pay more for a different quality FCS team and probably not have as good of a crowd.

Not all 1AA teams play BCS teams every year. If UNI isn't playing ISU or iowa, there's no guarantee that they will get that BCS payday. In fact, there's a good chance that they won't, because many BCS teams do not play 1AA teams. BTW, SDSU and NDSU would probably still bus to Ames.

 

[clones_jer]

Call it what you want. I personally do not know any fans who were excited to go see UNI specifically. Most would have attended no matter who ISU was playing that day. And if that IS the case with some fans, then they are not that good of fans. I'd MUCH rather see ISU play a Toledo or a UNLV. From what I remember, the UNLV crowd wasn't that bad...the Toledo crowd was definitely hurt from it being on Thursday night though.

Don't worry, I don't have to make the decision to quit playing UNI. The decision has already been made.

I know a TON of people that attended because it was UNI. There's always a bigger party when it's instate. Lot's of alumni back, not to mention hometown friends that go to UNI looking for a place to tailgate. There is no way you can tell me NDSU would've had our most attendance (or even 2nd most) if they had been on the schedule rather than UNI.

 

[ISUFan22]

This is getting ridiculous. It's basically a fact that game was a record in attendance because we were playing UNI. You can't tell me attendance would be the same for NDSU or nearly any other non-conference foe.

Just admit that you're willing to sacrifice attendance and dollars for ISU in order to maybe allow ISU to get a few walk-on players from UNI. Again, maybe.

And...just what ratio of walk-on players work out? Yes, we've had some that have done wonderfully, yet that's not the norm - hence why people make such a big deal of a walk-on player doing well.

For me, I'll take the packed house and guaranteed money over the chance we'd get a couple walk-on players from UNI. It's not that I want to play UNI, yet this "argument" for not playing them makes little sense...

Full stadium/money > walk-ons

 

[brianhos]

I think ISU has to keep playing UNI. We need the revenue 55K people bring. If they schedule a second kent st, or troy or something like that, they are going to sell 10,000 less seats. And with the 1AA rule for bowl games the way it is, UNI does not hurt us anymore.

10,000 x $30 = lots o' cash for ISU. It is the same as adding 600 new NCC cardinal members...

 

[ISUFan22]

Amen Brian. Cash speaks loudly.

I'm not in the boat that thinks we must keep playing them, yet financially it sure doesn't hurt us. And I seriously doubt it's hurting our performance (recruiting) by playing them.

 

[ornryactor]

And with the 1AA rule for bowl games the way it is, UNI does not hurt us anymore.

What is that rule, exactly? I can't remember.

 

[bmuff]

This is getting ridiculous. It's basically a fact that game was a record in attendance because we were playing UNI. You can't tell me attendance would be the same for NDSU or nearly any other non-conference foe.

Just admit that you're willing to sacrifice attendance and dollars for ISU in order to maybe allow ISU to get a few walk-on players from UNI. Again, maybe.

And...just what ratio of walk-on players work out? Yes, we've had some that have done wonderfully, yet that's not the norm - hence why people make such a big deal of a walk-on player doing well.

For me, I'll take the packed house and guaranteed money over the chance we'd get a couple walk-on players from UNI. It's not that I want to play UNI, yet this "argument" for not playing them makes little sense...

Full stadium/money > walk-ons

Well, I'll agree to disagree here. You can't tell me that interest in ISU/UNI is larger than ISU/iowa or ISU/Nebraska. But they DID set the record for ISU/UNI. Why?? IMO that is because it was Family Weekend, a night game and the right time of year. Sure, UNI brought some fans, and more fans than NDSU would bring, but it's not like they had 15k.

And don't give me the argument that NDSU/SDSU would be a huge drop in attendance (if everything else is equal). I think that we're past those days, especially for September games. Unless the game is on a Thursday, we should have 50k+ for every September game. That is only 10k walkup.

I personally want UNI to have to demote to D2. Not only would that help ISU with walk-ons, it would also funnel more fans our way. If UNI sucked, you can't tell me that a few of their bandwagon fans wouldn't rather come to Ames.

Also, I think that it is VERY shortsighted of you to downplay walk-ons. Imagine if ISU would have gotten a couple of UNI's starting DL (that stuffed our OL) to walk on? Or how about their OL, who was basically pushing our guys around? What if UNI snatches guys like Danielsen or Carstens down the line? Sorry, but I DO think that it is worth a SMALL attendance hit to avoid playing UNI.

Bottom line is that ISU does not owe them anything. If they see the minuses of playing UNI are larger than the plusses, then ISU will quit playing them (which they did).

 

[ISUFan22]

Well, I'll agree to disagree here. You can't tell me that interest in ISU/UNI is larger than ISU/iowa or ISU/Nebraska. But they DID set the record for ISU/UNI. Why?? IMO that is because it was Family Weekend, a night game and the right time of year. Sure, UNI brought some fans, and more fans than NDSU would bring, but it's not like they had 15k.

Hold up...I never said that interest in a UNI game was greater than Iowa or Nebraska. Yes, UNI did set the record last year, but it was close to other games. They do belong in the same conversation though. To think not having UNI and scheduling someone like NDSU would generate the same or even similar fan interest is naive.

And don't give me the argument that NDSU/SDSU would be a huge drop in attendance (if everything else is equal). I think that we're past those days, especially for September games. Unless the game is on a Thursday, we should have 50k+ for every September game. That is only 10k walkup.

You may think we're past these days, but we're not yet. I only need to point to Baylor from '05 after we just lost our first game in OT (4-1). That was less than two years ago. I don't doubt it will happen again - unfortunately. It's not defeatist or pessimistic. It's just being realistic.

I personally want UNI to have to demote to D2. Not only would that help ISU with walk-ons, it would also funnel more fans our way. If UNI sucked, you can't tell me that a few of their bandwagon fans wouldn't rather come to Ames.

You sound exactly like some of the Iowa fans we despise when they speak of ISU in this way. So your recipe for success is for the competition to get worse, rather than ISU work harder to get better? I'm glad Chizik doesn't share your views in that respect.

It's also a huge stretch to think that our game vs. UNI allows them to maintain the D-IAA level. They seemed to do just fine when we weren't playing them.

Also, I think that it is VERY shortsighted of you to downplay walk-ons. Imagine if ISU would have gotten a couple of UNI's starting DL (that stuffed our OL) to walk on? Or how about their OL, who was basically pushing our guys around? What if UNI snatches guys like Danielsen or Carstens down the line? Sorry, but I DO think that it is worth a SMALL attendance hit to avoid playing UNI.

Again, I'm being realistic about walk-ons. With every one that works, I'll bet 10 others (or more) barely see the field, if ever. I'll take ticket sales and a full stadium over 1/10 odds.

Bottom line is that ISU does not owe them anything. If they see the minuses of playing UNI are larger than the plusses, then ISU will quit playing them (which they did).

Didn't say we owe UNI or any other team anything - other than a good butt whipping on the field. :biggrin9gp: You claim that not having UNI on the schedule was because it wasn't in our best interest. Well, Pollard being a financial guy, he looks at money and it was financially in our interests. However, a good number of the future schedules were already done prior to the game in '06. I have no idea why we're not playing UNI and it doesn't matter to me. I really don't care too much who we play - football is football to me.

Yet I do know the ISU-UNI game benefits us quite nicely. You can see that one in the bank.

 

[pantherjoe]

Gotta say Im surprised to see this out of Iowa State fans because the attitude Im seeing here is very similar to the way Iowa fans treat Iowa State and I know that ISU fans dont like it. Its funny hearing ISU fans throwing around the terms like "Superbowl" and "little brother".

This would be a cool game to win for us, and our fans and players are excited to play, but it is NOT, I repeat, IS NOT, our biggest game of the year. I would rather take a conference game- Southern Illinois, Youngstown State, etc- than ISU because it will help us achieve the bottom line and that is to win a national championship. I would rather lose to ISU by 500 and win in the playoffs than beat ISU and lose in the playoffs, and all true UNI fans would agree with me. We have a chance to win the national title each and every year and the only game we hold above all others is the one in Chattanooga in December.

Secondly, what makes you think that refusing to play UNI would "cripple" our program? Its true that the BCS payday is a big part of our budget, but ISU isnt the only BCS team in the nation. We would have no trouble finding another BCS team to play us if we needed too. Its not like ISU has this magical power to keep our program afloat that nobody else has. We could survive WITHOUT the BCS money entirely if we had too, but we wouldnt have to because we would find someone else. We play in the best PCS football conference and the best non-BCS basketball conference in the nation. We wouldnt just "fall to D2" because the mighty Cyclones wouldnt play us.

Thank you to the ones who are keeping a level head about this. To the ones that arent- you sound like Hawk fans.

PS- If Im not mistaken your future PCS scheduled opponents wernt scheduled by Chizik either.

 

[ornryactor]

Gotta say Im surprised to see this out of Iowa State fans because the attitude Im seeing here is very similar to the way Iowa fans treat Iowa State and I know that ISU fans dont like it. Its funny hearing ISU fans throwing around the terms like "Superbowl" and "little brother".

This would be a cool game to win for us, and our fans and players are excited to play, but it is NOT, I repeat, IS NOT, our biggest game of the year. I would rather take a conference game- Southern Illinois, Youngstown State, etc- than ISU because it will help us achieve the bottom line and that is to win a national championship. I would rather lose to ISU by 500 and win in the playoffs than beat ISU and lose in the playoffs, and all true UNI fans would agree with me. We have a chance to win the national title each and every year and the only game we hold above all others is the one in Chattanooga in December.

Secondly, what makes you think that refusing to play UNI would "cripple" our program? Its true that the BCS payday is a big part of our budget, but ISU isnt the only BCS team in the nation. We would have no trouble finding another BCS team to play us if we needed too. Its not like ISU has this magical power to keep our program afloat that nobody else has. We could survive WITHOUT the BCS money entirely if we had too, but we wouldnt have to because we would find someone else. We play in the best PCS football conference and the best non-BCS basketball conference in the nation. We wouldnt just "fall to D2" because the mighty Cyclones wouldnt play us.

Thank you to the ones who are keeping a level head about this. To the ones that arent- you sound like Hawk fans.

PS- If Im not mistaken your future PCS scheduled opponents wernt scheduled by Chizik either.

Welcome, pantherjoe.

I think most of us feel the same way about playing our in-state rivals. Yeah, they're probably the most emotional games of the season, and its great for bragging rights, but any of us would rather lose to UNI or UI and win the conference or NCAA titles. (It's a little tougher for us to go the 'national champion' route, since the BCS system is a giant arbitrary mess, and not a clean set of rules like the playoff bracket.) If we're goign to be on the bubble, I'd much rather lose to UNI or Iowa and cream Texas or Oklahoma (or both!).

Of course, if we somehow knew in advance we couldn't make a bowl, I'd want to obliterate UNI and Iowa as hard and as painfully as possible, causing them the maximum amount of shame. Isn't that what a great rivalry is all about? :rolleyes5cz:

 

[pantherjoe]

I would agree with that almost 100%. Everything except the PCS playoffs being finite (think NCAA basketball tournament). I also feel obliged to say that Ive never been treated better by away fans than I was treated when I went to the ISU-UNI game last year.

 

[ISUFan22]

I also feel obliged to say that Ive never been treated better by away fans than I was treated when I went to the ISU-UNI game last year.

I would venture to guess seeing how last year's game went, I wouldn't expect the same hospitality this time around. :wink0st:

Seriously though, it's good to have ya over here. Any thoughts on what is expected from UNI as far as performance goes by the fans and those outside UNI?

 

[bmuff]

Duplicate.

 

[bmuff]

Hold up...I never said that interest in a UNI game was greater than Iowa or Nebraska. Yes, UNI did set the record last year, but it was close to other games. They do belong in the same conversation though. To think not having UNI and scheduling someone like NDSU would generate the same or even similar fan interest is naive.

You may think we're past these days, but we're not yet. I only need to point to Baylor from '05 after we just lost our first game in OT (4-1). That was less than two years ago. I don't doubt it will happen again - unfortunately. It's not defeatist or pessimistic. It's just being realistic.

Well, as far as I know, that Baylor game wasn't in September, so it's not on equal ground with UNI games. I'm talking SEPTEMBER games. IMO, all of our September games (not counting Thursday night/Labor Day Weekend games) will push 50k. I mean, we will have 35k+ season tickets, that's asking less than 10k walk-up. So NDSU has 50k and UNI has 54k. Big deal.​

You sound exactly like some of the Iowa fans we despise when they speak of ISU in this way. So your recipe for success is for the competition to get worse, rather than ISU work harder to get better? I'm glad Chizik doesn't share your views in that respect.

No, my recipe for success is to get better players. And no matter how you look at it, it will be at the expense of other schools. Sorry to say it, but ISU's success in some part will come at the expense of iowa and UNI...iowa with in-state recruiting and UNI with walk-ons.​

It's also a huge stretch to think that our game vs. UNI allows them to maintain the D-IAA level. They seemed to do just fine when we weren't playing them.

OK, then let them. They don't need our charity. They are going to have at least five years here without playing ISU. Find another payday...or don't, I don't care.​

Yet I do know the ISU-UNI game benefits us quite nicely. You can see that one in the bank.

OK, then why aren't we playing them again through 2013, while we ARE playing NDSU and SDSU. Pollard is no idiot, he sees the bottom line. ISU could play UNI each of the next 10 years if they wanted, but they won't play until at least after 2013. Why???​

 

[ISUFan22]

Well, as far as I know, that Baylor game wasn't in September, so it's not on equal ground with UNI games. I'm talking SEPTEMBER games. IMO, all of our September games (not counting Thursday night/Labor Day Weekend games) will push 50k. I mean, we will have 35k+ season tickets, that's asking less than 10k walk-up. So NDSU has 50k and UNI has 54k. Big deal.

LMAO. So you expect better attendance for non-conference games just because they are in Sept. over a Big 12 game in early October? I hope our fan base doesn't think like you, otherwise Pollard and Chizik won't be here long.

To think that we'd only 4000 drop-off between UNI and NDSU is rather presumptuous. Especially when history says otherwise when looking at non-conference foes not named UNI and Iowa.

No, my recipe for success is to get better players. And no matter how you look at it, it will be at the expense of other schools. Sorry to say it, but ISU's success in some part will come at the expense of iowa and UNI...iowa with in-state recruiting and UNI with walk-ons.

I certainly hope our recipe for getting better players doesn't mean competing with guys UNI will or may get.

OK, then let them. They don't need our charity. They are going to have at least five years here without playing ISU. Find another payday...or don't, I don't care.

Methinks they'll do just fine. I don't see 'em folding up shop or dropping off just because we're not on their schedule.

OK, then why aren't we playing them again through 2013, while we ARE playing NDSU and SDSU. Pollard is no idiot, he sees the bottom line. ISU could play UNI each of the next 10 years if they wanted, but they won't play until at least after 2013. Why???

No idea. Perhaps it has something to do with having 2 of our 4 non-conference games against the same teams each year. You immediately assume otherwise though - that it must be because he thinks we're helping UNI too much. I find that very hard to believe when there is no data to support it.

 

[tester]

I would agree with that almost 100%. Everything except the PCS playoffs being finite (think NCAA basketball tournament). I also feel obliged to say that Ive never been treated better by away fans than I was treated when I went to the ISU-UNI game last year.

I feel obliged to second this. Treatment from ISU fans was great the only disapointing part was the final score!

 

[bmuff]

LMAO. So you expect better attendance for non-conference games just because they are in Sept. over a Big 12 game in early October? I hope our fan base doesn't think like you, otherwise Pollard and Chizik won't be here long.

To think that we'd only 4000 drop-off between UNI and NDSU is rather presumptuous. Especially when history says otherwise when looking at non-conference foes not named UNI and Iowa.
I certainly hope our recipe for getting better players doesn't mean competing with guys UNI will or may get. Methinks they'll do just fine. I don't see 'em folding up shop or dropping off just because we're not on their schedule.
No idea. Perhaps it has something to do with having 2 of our 4 non-conference games against the same teams each year. You immediately assume otherwise though - that it must be because he thinks we're helping UNI too much. I find that very hard to believe when there is no data to support it.

I DO think that September games have better attendance. What other reason would there be that there are more fans for UNI than for Nebraska? Or Mizzou? Or Texas Tech? It has a LOT more to do with farmers (and those who work with farmers) being busier in October than just fan interest.

I think PART of our recipe for success is improving the walk-on program. THAT would definitely be at the expense of UNI.

As for why we're not playing UNI again until at least 2014, hey, I'm just speculating. But if this was such a great game for everyone with only positives, I guarantee we'd still be playing them. It's not like Pollard can't see exactly how much money every game brought in. BTW, you seem pretty defensive about this whole thing. All I'm doing is stating my opinion...no need to get upset!

 

[pantherjoe]

I would venture to guess seeing how last year's game went, I wouldn't expect the same hospitality this time around. :wink0st:

Seriously though, it's good to have ya over here. Any thoughts on what is expected from UNI as far as performance goes by the fans and those outside UNI?

We are VERY excited about this season. Were being ranked in the Top 5-10 in almost every preseason poll, we have a very large chunk of both our offense and defense back from a team that we very good but very inconsistant last year and was snubbed from the playoffs by the committee. Most of our o-line and almost all of our skill position players are back, including QB Eric Sanders who was also the QB for our run to the national title game two years ago. Our biggest problem will be in the secondary where we lost Dre Dokes (the guy who returned the interception for the TD last year against you guys). If we we can find a way to replace that big play guy on defense, we should be able to make a run at the Gateway and deep into the playoffs. Our goal is the National Championship and anything less than at least the Gateway title and a final four would be a dissappointment this year.

You guys think youll make it to a bowl this year? Tough schedule for sure. Im a UNI fan first, but I root for Drake, ISU and yes, even Iowa when were not playing you. Good luck, I hope you go 12-1.