Sorry,tazclone. Have to agree with this post as to the facts here. However,I do agree about this really being screwed up by the university on procedure here. No way this should have been attempted "internally".
Best and Worst Developmental Football Programs
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Sorry,tazclone. Have to agree with this post as to the facts here. However,I do agree about this really being screwed up by the university on procedure here. No way this should have been attempted "internally".
I guess I read the report differntly than you.
As far as the players...if they raped someone and lied to you, then you kick their *** off the team and say goodbye. You don't owe them anything and definitely not a reommeendation. Someone calls and asks about them, you say they are no longer on the team and due to privacy laws, you can't discuss. It is like when you have a bad employee. It is the **** way out if you recommend them to another company to get rid of them. You fire them.
the recommendation was crap. Sugarcoat it however you want. Twist it, whatever. He helped two rapist continue to play football when he should have helped two rapists get put in jail...if he knew anything
I like your work here TazClone.. I agree with it all. I also love how these guys can never reply back to the facts (with facts) rather they just repeat what others have told them about their program. These guys will continue to say "there no proof of the rape" so it never happened. Well if they think and believe like this, then they are probably the same guys who think that Barry Bonds/Roger Clemons didn’t take steroids.
Good grief man...
what else should KF have done? He did kick their butts off the team. They never again participated in any football-related activities after the incident was reported. You don't like the recommendation, that's fine. There might be a chance that there was a reason for the recommendation (which I outlined above).
What exactly should KF have done to put them in jail? Now he is the DA as well as the FB coach? From the very beginning, KF and Barta knew very well that the victim and KF shouldn't be having any contact, because it was not in KF's power to give the victim the justice she was seeking. Only the Johnson County DA and a jury could do that. All KF knew for sure at that time was that Everson and Satterfield were lying to him as to their whereabouts on the night of the incident, so that's why he booted them. They sure as heck were not going to admit to him they did what they were accused of, nor should have he been getting involved in any way into an investigation.
Believe me, there are elements within the university and regents who would have liked nothing better than to drive KF out had he covered up or obstructed anything in this case. But nothing in the Stolar Group's report indicates that Barta or KF acted improperly. They were about the only people involved who did what they were supposed to do.
It was a complicated, long and embarrassing situation for the entire university. The university's Legal Counsel and the Dean of Students lost their jobs over it. And President Mason was lucky she didn't lose hers. From the very instant the victim reported the attack, she should have been directed to the IC Police or the DA's office, as they are trained to handle these cases, not university administrators or athletic department officials.
what else should KF have done? He did kick their butts off the team. They never again participated in any football-related activities after the incident was reported. You don't like the recommendation, that's fine. There might be a chance that there was a reason for the recommendation (which I outlined above).
What exactly should KF have done to put them in jail? Now he is the DA as well as the FB coach? From the very beginning, KF and Barta knew very well that the victim and KF shouldn't be having any contact, because it was not in KF's power to give the victim the justice she was seeking. Only the Johnson County DA and a jury could do that. All KF knew for sure at that time was that Everson and Satterfield were lying to him as to their whereabouts on the night of the incident, so that's why he booted them. They sure as heck were not going to admit to him they did what they were accused of, nor should have he been getting involved in any way into an investigation.
Believe me, there are elements within the university and regents who would have liked nothing better than to drive KF out had he covered up or obstructed anything in this case. But nothing in the Stolar Group's report indicates that Barta or KF acted improperly. They were about the only people involved who did what they were supposed to do.
It was a complicated, long and embarrassing situation for the entire university. The university's Legal Counsel and the Dean of Students lost their jobs over it. And President Mason was lucky she didn't lose hers. From the very instant the victim reported the attack, she should have been directed to the IC Police or the DA's office, as they are trained to handle these cases, not university administrators or athletic department officials.
You want the facts...
here is an excerpt from the Stolar Report.
(c) Performance of Kirk Ferentz, Head Football Coach
The Investigators found no credible evidence of any attempt at a conscious
or overt cover-up of the October 14 incident on the part of Kirk Ferentz. Ferentz acted promptly and to his highest level of authority when he was informed of the incident. Any public statements he made regarding his knowledge of the incident, which appeared to be less than candid, were made due to misinterpretation of a court order. Finally, there is no evidence suggesting that Ferentz ordered the two football players to move back into the room where the alleged assault occurred with the intent to destroy evidence.
The investigation indicates that when Ferentz was informed on October 15 of the
allegations of misconduct against his players, he took the most stringent disciplinary
action within his power against the athletes. After learning of the incident on October 15, Ferentz immediately questioned Football Player #1 and his roommate, Football
Player #2, regarding their involvement. 87
Ferentz felt that the two football players were not truthful with him regarding their involvement so he suspended them both from the football team on October 17.
The UI Student-Athlete Code of Conduct allows an athlete to be suspended from team participation for “willfully giving false and malicious information to a University official.â€
Ferentz could not issue any more serious or permanent sanctions unless and until the players were convicted of a criminal act by a court of law or were found to have committed a violation of University policy by EOD.
The Investigators also found no evidence that Kirk Ferentz was intentionally
deceptive to the public with respect to his knowledge of the incident. Following the
incident, Ferentz made public statements to the effect that he could not comment about the details of the October 14 incident or the University’s investigation of it.
The Investigators found no evidence that these statements were made with the intent to mislead the public or cover up the incident. Rather, they were made based upon misinterpretation of a court order and privacy laws by the General Counsel and others, which suggested any acknowledgement of the incident or its investigation would be a violation of FERPA and/or court orders issued pursuant to the criminal investigation.
The evidence suggests that Ferentz’s statements were made with the intent to protect the privacy rights of the Student-Athlete rather than to conceal the incident in any way.
Finally, the Investigators found no evidence to suggest that in instructing two
football players to move back into the room where the alleged assault occurred, Ferentz was attempting to destroy evidence of the incident. The football players were
sophomores and were required to live in the dormitory. When Ferentz learned neither
was living in the room, he ordered one player back into the room, and another player
agreed to move in with him. The second player assigned to the room turned in his key on October 30 and was “ghosting†all year. Ferentz stated that he was simply enforcing the mandatory on-campus living requirement when he instructed the athletes to move back into the room.
The Investigators spoke with one of the football players, who was supposed to reside in Room N207, and who stated that Ferentz told him to move into the room on or about October 16 “because it was the rules†and that he was never instructed to destroy anything in the room. He stated that it is possible to “earn†your way out of the dorm, but he had had other issues, and when Ferentz found out he was off-campus, he
had to move back. Furthermore, as mentioned earlier, no player moved back into
Room N207 until approximately October 27 or 28.
If the players were instructed to move into the room in order to destroy evidence, it is more likely that they would have done so immediately rather than waiting for almost two weeks, in which time University or law enforcement authorities could have collected any such evidence."
The full report is available here.
I have never said a rape did not occur, nor have many Iowa fans (although I'm sure some did). After following the trial, I can see why the DA was hesitant to press charges as you had a victim who remembered not one thing about what happened during the time period when it occurred. That doesn't mean it didn't happen, or that Everson and Satterfield weren't/aren't creeps, it just means it was next to impossible to prove to a jury.
here is an excerpt from the Stolar Report.
(c) Performance of Kirk Ferentz, Head Football Coach
The Investigators found no credible evidence of any attempt at a conscious
or overt cover-up of the October 14 incident on the part of Kirk Ferentz. Ferentz acted promptly and to his highest level of authority when he was informed of the incident. Any public statements he made regarding his knowledge of the incident, which appeared to be less than candid, were made due to misinterpretation of a court order. Finally, there is no evidence suggesting that Ferentz ordered the two football players to move back into the room where the alleged assault occurred with the intent to destroy evidence.
The investigation indicates that when Ferentz was informed on October 15 of the
allegations of misconduct against his players, he took the most stringent disciplinary
action within his power against the athletes. After learning of the incident on October 15, Ferentz immediately questioned Football Player #1 and his roommate, Football
Player #2, regarding their involvement. 87
Ferentz felt that the two football players were not truthful with him regarding their involvement so he suspended them both from the football team on October 17.
The UI Student-Athlete Code of Conduct allows an athlete to be suspended from team participation for “willfully giving false and malicious information to a University official.â€
Ferentz could not issue any more serious or permanent sanctions unless and until the players were convicted of a criminal act by a court of law or were found to have committed a violation of University policy by EOD.
The Investigators also found no evidence that Kirk Ferentz was intentionally
deceptive to the public with respect to his knowledge of the incident. Following the
incident, Ferentz made public statements to the effect that he could not comment about the details of the October 14 incident or the University’s investigation of it.
The Investigators found no evidence that these statements were made with the intent to mislead the public or cover up the incident. Rather, they were made based upon misinterpretation of a court order and privacy laws by the General Counsel and others, which suggested any acknowledgement of the incident or its investigation would be a violation of FERPA and/or court orders issued pursuant to the criminal investigation.
The evidence suggests that Ferentz’s statements were made with the intent to protect the privacy rights of the Student-Athlete rather than to conceal the incident in any way.
Finally, the Investigators found no evidence to suggest that in instructing two
football players to move back into the room where the alleged assault occurred, Ferentz was attempting to destroy evidence of the incident. The football players were
sophomores and were required to live in the dormitory. When Ferentz learned neither
was living in the room, he ordered one player back into the room, and another player
agreed to move in with him. The second player assigned to the room turned in his key on October 30 and was “ghosting†all year. Ferentz stated that he was simply enforcing the mandatory on-campus living requirement when he instructed the athletes to move back into the room.
The Investigators spoke with one of the football players, who was supposed to reside in Room N207, and who stated that Ferentz told him to move into the room on or about October 16 “because it was the rules†and that he was never instructed to destroy anything in the room. He stated that it is possible to “earn†your way out of the dorm, but he had had other issues, and when Ferentz found out he was off-campus, he
had to move back. Furthermore, as mentioned earlier, no player moved back into
Room N207 until approximately October 27 or 28.
If the players were instructed to move into the room in order to destroy evidence, it is more likely that they would have done so immediately rather than waiting for almost two weeks, in which time University or law enforcement authorities could have collected any such evidence."
The full report is available here.
I have never said a rape did not occur, nor have many Iowa fans (although I'm sure some did). After following the trial, I can see why the DA was hesitant to press charges as you had a victim who remembered not one thing about what happened during the time period when it occurred. That doesn't mean it didn't happen, or that Everson and Satterfield weren't/aren't creeps, it just means it was next to impossible to prove to a jury.
Just like there was no way for KF to know which kids are going to come in and do illegal things? I don't know what else KF can do in those situations but boot the kids off the team for the major crimes they commit, which he did.
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Ah, yes, again, NEVER answer questions. Did kirkie know that a RAPE occurred? Well he "kicked" the two players off the team, so YES. Did he send players into the room KNOWING that there was a crime committed in that room? YES
Again dodge deflect, and deny, BUT never provide ANY facts. Being a pathetic piece of **** is not a defense, it is sad.
It is obvious that you would never be able to muster up enough character and candor to ever actually admit to the TRUTH. I feel sad that you, and the other breds, even take up valuable oxygen that could be put to much better use by actual people.
Amazingly enough, you omit a VERY important piece of information in your defense of your hero....You seem to have forgotten to mention that after he kicked these RAPISTS off the team, they gave them glowing recommendations to other coaches.
Knowing what happened, and the fact that they knew why they kicked these two RAPISTS off the team, they still found time to give good character reports to Lou Tepper.
Yep, ol kirkie the scum is a hell of a guy. Of course candor, and honesty are not traits that you and the other breds seem to be capable of possessing.
Uhh, maybe don't recruit thugs from inner-city Detroit? Seems to me that iowa got off of their recruiting tactics that made them successful..at least for a few years. Regardless, maybe you shouldn't be throwing stones if we're both going to the "how could he have known" card.
Re: Good grief man...
Wow, so now the BoR was against poor kirkie the scum....You have to love the audacity of some of these "people."
It was a terrible thing the u did to that girl. But it went even beyond that. When the mother of the VICTIM writes that the county attorney did everything in her power to discourage her from prosecuting these RAPISTS. Then you find out that she is a donor, and has season tix to football games, and you realize that justice was never going to be done.
There were articles in the dsm reg that he admitted to being in a meeting with the VICTIM'S father the monday after she was RAPED. Remember his indignance about even being questioned, and he said that someone should have written the information down during the meeting....I am sure that there is something about that on here.
The thing that is so funny with these idiot u fans on here defending their hero to the death is that they repeat the same old tired ******** that the u fans have used for years. They offer no proof, they show a complete lack of truthfulness, and candor....It's just the same spin over and over.
They really do think that kirkie the piece of **** is the dumbest man on the planet.
Wow, so now the BoR was against poor kirkie the scum....You have to love the audacity of some of these "people."
It was a terrible thing the u did to that girl. But it went even beyond that. When the mother of the VICTIM writes that the county attorney did everything in her power to discourage her from prosecuting these RAPISTS. Then you find out that she is a donor, and has season tix to football games, and you realize that justice was never going to be done.
There were articles in the dsm reg that he admitted to being in a meeting with the VICTIM'S father the monday after she was RAPED. Remember his indignance about even being questioned, and he said that someone should have written the information down during the meeting....I am sure that there is something about that on here.
The thing that is so funny with these idiot u fans on here defending their hero to the death is that they repeat the same old tired ******** that the u fans have used for years. They offer no proof, they show a complete lack of truthfulness, and candor....It's just the same spin over and over.
They really do think that kirkie the piece of **** is the dumbest man on the planet.
You said that they thought the RAPISTS were innocent....OK, well if that is the case, then why did kirkie suspend them, and "suggest" that they transfer?
If these RAPISTS were truly innocent, then why not let the justice system take it's course, like he has done with so many of the other CRIMINALS?
I don't expect you to answer, it would require too much honesty.
Thugs from inner city Detroit? Have you been outside the state of Iowa ever?
What "thugs from the city of Detroit" are you talking about?
If you're speaking of Dominique Douglas, there were no indications that he'd turn out that way. He was considered a bright kid and an outstanding student in high school.
All that's been answered multiple times. Learn to read pal. It's not my job to hold your hand and guide you through these posts. Read Dodger's accounts and the article he pasted. You call it a deflection which is fine. But it's the answer. If it's not good enough for you....well that doesn't bother me too much. My guess is no answer would be good enough for you.
So how do you think ISU's O-line will look this year Mikem???? HAHAH. Look who I'm asking.
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I would probably check into what Stolar really does, and I would check into who their client was when the investigation was conducted before acting all tough there skippy.
But, apparently, according to you, and the dodger, we can ascertain that you all do think that kirkie the scum is the dumbest man alive. All that "report" said kirkie supposedly didn't "knowingly" commit a crime.
You would think that after the PP fiasco all of the u coaches would have seen how flawed the internal investigation system is. So how dumb would you have to be to continue to use the same method? Of course we have already covered that he KNEW about the RAPE, yet didn't do anything to preserve the evidence of the RAPE that TWO of HIS players committed.
My favorite was the dodger stating how it was best for everyone involved to have the players transfer.....But is was not that important to have them removed from the same floor as the girl they RAPED. IF it was in the "best interests" of everyone, then they should have been removed from the school in order to protect the VICTIM (of course NOONE was thinking about the VICTIM, it was about the program).
You have to love the logic that some of these use to justify their hero.... I mean we are talking about a "man" they obviously believe to be an absolute moron, with very little functioning brain matter. BUT they are so soul less, and deluded, that they hunker down and defend with all of their might.....
Apparently only when the media in the state has no choice but to ask him about it....Other than that, he doesn't seem to really give two ***** what his players do.
If his sons have shown us nothing else, they have shown that kirkie doesn't care what his kids do, so you can imagine how little he cares when they belong to someone else (depending where they line up on the depth chart, of course).
Of course when you all believed him when he said he didn't know where his kid lived, even though they live in the same small town....So I guess it's all a moot point.
OK, you got me. I've never been outside of Iowa ever. LOL. I've likely seen more of the world that you have or will ever see. Please try to debate that KF didn't get off on the wrong path, recruiting-wise, for a little bit there. And while you're at it, take a look at these images:
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Hey, at least we answered your question(unlike you). You just didn't like the answer. I can't help it if you're deluded mind spits out conspiracy theories at a record pace. And by the way, I've been on the record as being quite critical of Ferentz(another one of your assumptions smacked back in your face) several times. Heck, I made a post on this site less than 2 weeks ago that Ferentz runs the Iowa program too much like an NFL squad and that I felt it may contribute to a lot of the off field problems we have. He simply doesn't spend enough one on one time with the players and delegates too much responsibility to his assistants.
What is it you want Iowa fans to do? Chase Kirk out of town with pitchforks? There is a reason why we've only had two coaches since 1979. Hayden had flaws as well. But we stand by our (football)coaches. We accept that they have faults and we hope they learn from them. But we also don't close our eyes to all of the great things they do for the program and for eastern Iowa. Do we complain about them from time to time to each other? Sure. But we'll definitely stick up for him if someone else goes after him. Kind of like how you will beat the hell out of your little brother, but if someone else tries to mess with him they'll have a fight on their hands. I'm not sure why this is so difficult for you to understand. Maybe it's a side effect of not being a "sports guy".
One more thing. Personally, I think that it is easier for a coach to judge whether a recruit is going to be a thug than for a manager to predict one of his employees is into kiddie porn. Usually adults hide their secrets a little better. You always hear the neighbors of a serial killer saying what a quiet nice guy he was.