SIAP: Travis Hines with a great article
- Thread starter swarthmoreCY
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Yep. It sucks we lost in our biggest game, to a team not as good as several we have beaten, but there is not much more to draw from it. It happens to teams with a lot more talent than us, and it happens to more elite programs than us. Our "off day" frequency is about as low as you will see. And it was not limited to just against teams "with less talent".
We need to play better than that, and the previous three teams did, while having equal or worse variability in quality of play in the regular season. The solution is to increase the talent to a level that when your off days come, you still win.
Given the external input data, it is more likely we did it so infrequently the perception of our talent was skewed by fans, thus generating this narrative.
Teams with fans that overestimate the talent difference by basing it on their near best performance against an opponents average performance has this "trend". Think Iowa football.
The problem is we lost to worse opponents this year. Yes, Duke, Kansas and OU did as well. But at the rate and caliber we did?
Kansas: Bad losses - K State and Temple (Both didn't make the tourney)
Oklahoma: Bad Losses - Creighton, Washington (who was ranked in the top 25 at the time), K-State (twice)
Duke: Bad Losses - Miami
Iowa State: Bad Losses - South Carolina, Texas Tech, Kansas State, UAB
I just want consistency from this team. The only thing we were consistent about was starting games slowly and falling behind by double digits.
I am excited that I get to complain about this instead of complaining that we can't even make the tournament during the dark ages. However, if we want to be in the same conversation with the likes of Kansas, Duke, Kentucky and the other blue bloods, we need to be more consistent. We need to start games better. We need to play better defense. We need to rebound better. Otherwise the farthest we'll find ourselves is sweet 16 every year or any round prior.
I have faith that Hoiberg can make those improvements. Because if he does, there is no telling how far his teams can go.
Next year's team is going to have some huge expectations. I hope they can handle them.
Kansas: Bad losses - K State and Temple (Both didn't make the tourney)
Oklahoma: Bad Losses - Creighton, Washington (who was ranked in the top 25 at the time), K-State (twice)
Duke: Bad Losses - Miami
Iowa State: Bad Losses - South Carolina, Texas Tech, Kansas State, UAB
I just want consistency from this team. The only thing we were consistent about was starting games slowly and falling behind by double digits.
I am excited that I get to complain about this instead of complaining that we can't even make the tournament during the dark ages. However, if we want to be in the same conversation with the likes of Kansas, Duke, Kentucky and the other blue bloods, we need to be more consistent. We need to start games better. We need to play better defense. We need to rebound better. Otherwise the farthest we'll find ourselves is sweet 16 every year or any round prior.
I have faith that Hoiberg can make those improvements. Because if he does, there is no telling how far his teams can go.
Next year's team is going to have some huge expectations. I hope they can handle them.
We had two guys (Bryce Dejean-Jones and Abdel Nader) that led their respective programs in scoring before coming here that came off of our bench...we were extremely talented.
We have 9 wins over teams that are still playing. That means we have some pretty good talent.
We may not have final four talent, but this team certainly had Sweet 16 talent.
We did not get beat by a talented team. UAB would have finished somewhere around #9 or 10 in the B12 this year.
Agree. With our length and quickness, we were extremely talented. We should have been a great defensive team. Anyone who saw the second half vs. KU in the Big 12 tourney could witness our talent, unless their BB IQ is extremely limited. The X factor is consistent effort though.
Effort may not be the right word but we definitely lacked something on the boards Thursday.
Effort, tenacity, desire, focus, whatever it was, we lacked it to get out rebounded by such a large margin.
The players don't owe you anything. Nobody is sticking a gun to your head and forcing you to buy tickets.
And yet were nowhere near the 6th man award. BDJ barely played in games and Nader is not someone you can count on. And being the leading scorer on a horrible MAC team while having bad efficiency numbers does not support your argument.
Number of assets is not as important as a complete set of assets.
We were extremely effective with the talents we have. We were not overly talented or as diverse in our talents as most other teams that achieve such success. ND is the only one I can readily think of that had equal or more.
What our program is going through is being able to handle the success. Clearly, a lot of the fanbase are not. Rankings and expectations don't win games. Beating up players after losses doesn't improve teams. You have to appreciate the wins and accept the losses.
The players need to ignore twitter. Ignore the media, and the hype. They mean nothing. What happens on the court is everything. We have a young Coach who is learning, and has led us to four straight NCAA's, but people still criticize. I think he is mature enough and confident enough to ignore and understand it. The players need to learn how to do the same thing.
If you want to be a db and tweet negativity at players that is your right, but don't kid yourself it can have a negative affect on the team. Hopefully, in the future they can channel all that negativity into motivation or ignore it, because it ain't going to stop.
The players need to ignore twitter. Ignore the media, and the hype. They mean nothing. What happens on the court is everything. We have a young Coach who is learning, and has led us to four straight NCAA's, but people still criticize. I think he is mature enough and confident enough to ignore and understand it. The players need to learn how to do the same thing.
If you want to be a db and tweet negativity at players that is your right, but don't kid yourself it can have a negative affect on the team. Hopefully, in the future they can channel all that negativity into motivation or ignore it, because it ain't going to stop.
Sure, our fan base travels well and sells out Hilton but that's not to say that there are plenty of dbag fans out there. I've seen so many posts on here and heard stories from others about people that are irrational about a game and don't stop complaining. Hell, there were guys behind me that booed Matt Thomas when he entered the West Virginia game at home. People cussing out Georges at the end of the Baylor game at home. I could go on and on with the examples, but a good portion of Iowa State's fan base doesn't know how to handle success.
Also, I love the people that say that players have Twitter so they can stroke their ego. Probably 90% of college aged kids have a Twitter. I don't use mine to get favorites and retweets. Twitter is a SOCIAL media site that the guys can use to get information and connect with other people just like anybody else. The players don't use it just to see the fans that suck up to them. Stop being so judgemental
Supports the fact of how frequently we played near our best. But the fact is no team does that every game. Just as important as frequency of your best is the depth of your average or bad games. That is what hurts us IMO. What is our ability compared to other top teams to win when shots, even good ones, are not falling?
We are somewhat a system team IMO. We can have all the effort and respect for the opponent we want, but if things are "off" we are very average. In fact, too much effort and nerves killed this team. They presss.
A lot of teams have Sweet 16 talent. I'd say we even had EE talent. Does not mean losing before than is surprising. UK may be the biggest favorite in over 30 years and some estimated it to be less than 40% on a NC. Based on talent and away from home, I wouldn't put our "type" of talent past average of that list of probable S16. Based on frequency of maximizing the talent, I would. The risk of a loss was more than we wanted to believe.
Last time I'm going to defend my comments becuase reading comprehension seems to be tough for some of you. I never said the players owe me anything, I never said anyone was forcing me to buy tickets.
My whole point was that this season did not meet my expectations. I'm sure that I am not alone. Did I enjoy the season yes, very much so.
My second point is that this may hurt more to people who are invested in the program, literally. I agree with the poster who said we all invest time. JP has rasied tixs greatly. This tells me the AD has rasied expectations, if not we couldn't demand this financial support. Some people agree with this some don't. I have a feeling the ones who don't are people who can't or don't donate money to ISU athletics.
Never said anybody owes me anything, if you look back I said this is all entertainment, and that people who get to travel to all these places and get into games for free (I.e. Hines or other reporters) may have a hard time understanding why fans have such high expectations.
Excellent, excellent posts! You can't describe the reality any better than with these four paragraphs. A team is never quite as good as the best win, nor as bad as the worst loss. It's like Orr's advice to Fred when he took the job, "If you want to win, find the players." Consistency will stabilize more and more as the overall talent level increases more and more. We've been witnessing that during Fred's tenure. That's NOT hard to see, it's just that many don't WANT to see it! Too bad, because one's level of enjoyment is directly proportionate to one's level of realistic vision.
I think a guy that has inside connections with the program and gets to speak candidly with players, coaches, and others with the program would understand it a little more than the average fan. Just my opinion though. I have student season tickets and while that is nowhere near what you presumably invest in Iowa State athletics, I still shelled out the money for it and while I was disappointed at the way the season ended, I have to side with Hines on this issue.
UAB did not play lights out to beat us. They shot under 35%. They made three 3pointers as a team, and only made 9 ft's.
They just completely out worked us. You don't give up 19 offensive boards to an inferior opponent by 'giving too much effort'. The players themselves talked about getting lackadaisical, and how they should've played harder.
They just completely out worked us. You don't give up 19 offensive boards to an inferior opponent by 'giving too much effort'. The players themselves talked about getting lackadaisical, and how they should've played harder.