GRAYER RETURNING TO MICHIGAN

[cyclonenum1]

Seriously, what percentage of assistant coaches keep their job when they were hired by the outgoing coach? And what is the percentage of assistants who keep their job when hired by the outgoing coach and they never even coached on that schools bench for a season?

I realize Jeff has a special place in your heart, as do many of Johnny's boys. He does in mine too. But to characterize the attempt to find a place for Jeff in the program rather than "throwing him on the scrapheap" right away as "using" him, is extremely unfair. Freddy is one of Johnny's boys, too.

I expected more out of you, cyclonenum1.

As I said, none of us know anything about what truly transpired here.

That being said, we don't know that there was an attempt to find a place for Grayer. It appears so, but we don't know that.

And it also appears (I never said it is fact) that Grayer was thrown to the scrap heap. Maybe that was not the case but that is how it appears.

 

[gocubs2118]

This is simply bass ackwards...the assistant slots are for the less experienced not the head slots in nearly all cases.

But this isn't like most cases, now is it.

 

[cyclonenum1]

There might be a couple here who know what has been going on, but for the most part, you are correct. Yet, despite the fact that you probably don't know what was going on behind the scenes, you feel the need to proclaim:



Why do this? Do you have some inside knowledge of the circumstances and situation?

I never said I knew what happened...again, I said it appears that way. I never said it was the gospel fact.

 

[VeloClone]

Um, like you just did?

You said you were confused. I pointed out that there are ways to look at it that make perfect sense that don't cast dispersions on the program. It's a pretty simple explanation and generally the simple ones are more likely correct. Why are so many people convinced there is something nefarious going on?

By the way, I never said I was confused, because I'm not.

 

[cyclonenum1]

Firstly- all blame needs to be leveled at Mac for the situation.

Secondly-none of us will ever likely know what truly transpiried over the last few months. Seeing that Jeff is leaving of his own accord with a new job lined up tells me isu and the ath dept did everything they could and more to help a fellow cyclone out. He was by no means thrown to the scrap heap.

Now there is something I can agree on...McDermott was a veritable grim reaper for ISU MBB...everything he touched was akin to death.

 

[cyclonenum1]

You said you were confused. I pointed out that there are ways to look at it that make perfect sense that don't cast dispersions on the program. It's a pretty simple explanation and generally the simple ones are more likely correct. Why are so many people convinced there is something nefarious going on?

By the way, I never said I was confused, because I'm not.

Actually, you are...it's "aspersions". FYI.

 

[VeloClone]

As I said, none of us know anything about what truly transpired here.

That being said, we don't know that there was an attempt to find a place for Grayer. It appears so, but we don't know that.

And it also appears (I never said it is fact) that Grayer was thrown to the scrap heap. Maybe that was not the case but that is how it appears.

Yes, you said it "appears", it "smacks of" and then you proceed to continue your post acting as if it was fact: "He deserved better." If you don't know, how do you know he deserved better?

Maybe it appears to you because you are looking for the worst in each situation. It doesn't appear that way to me. Have you been happy with a single BB coach since Johnny?

 

[VeloClone]

Actually, you are...it's "aspersions". FYI.

I stand corrected. I don't find a vocabulary error as a confusion of the facts.

The point remains that there are a lot of people who a jumping to the worst possible scenario for what little facts there are here. There are a lot of scenarios that fit the facts we have and would be a perfectly legitimate way to deal with the situation. Those are being ignored.

 

[bosco]

My guess is that there is already an AC in place but ISU won't announce it until after awhile. It would be disrespectful to Grayer to immediately announce his replacement before he even has his bags packed.

except for the fact that it wouldn't be a replacement...

You are technically right since he was holding an "administrative" position. Interesting that Hoiberg said, "Jeff wants to be able to recruit and be on the floor coaching the players. Unfortunately, NCAA rules only allow us to have three assistant coaches". Makes me think that they already have their 3rd AC in the fold.

 

[ricochet]

As I said, none of us know anything about what truly transpired here.

That being said, we don't know that there was an attempt to find a place for Grayer. It appears so, but we don't know that.

And it also appears (I never said it is fact) that Grayer was thrown to the scrap heap. Maybe that was not the case but that is how it appears.

Doesn't appear that way to me. If he wasn't Jeff Grayer I think he would have been let go long ago. It appears to me we kept him around while he decided if he wanted a non coaching position/looked for another job. I wouldn't call that thrown to the scrap heap.

 

[jbhtexas]

I never said I knew what happened...again, I said it appears that way. I never said it was the gospel fact.

So if you don't know what happened, why speculate about what happened in a manner that generates controversy, and accuses the new head coach/AD staff of doing something unsavory to an ISU great that may very well not be true?

 

[Cydkar]

I never said I knew what happened...again, I said it appears that way. I never said it was the gospel fact.

It appears that way to you and, of course, some others but not to everybody.

 

[cyclonenum1]

So if you don't know what happened, why speculate about what happened in a manner that generates controversy, and accuses the new head coach/AD staff of doing something unsavory to an ISU great that may very well not be true?

Oh, pardon me, I didn't know that speculation was illegal on this site.

I never accused anyone (staff or administration) of anything unsavory. My ire is typically (and in this case) pointed at the many posters on this site that talk out of both sides of their mouths...ie: Hoiberg is a perfect hire but Grayer has too little coaching experience to be an assistant...that is ridiculous.

 

[VeloClone]

Oh, pardon me, I didn't know that speculation was illegal on this site.

I never accused anyone (staff or administration) of anything unsavory. My ire is typically (and in this case) pointed at the many posters on this site that talk out of both sides of their mouths...ie: Hoiberg is a perfect hire but Grayer has too little coaching experience to be an assistant...that is ridiculous.

When you say "He deserved better", you are most certainly insinuating that the coaches did him wrong.

I didn't say you couldn't speculate, I asked why you would.

Say what you want. I'm done.

 

[Tornado man]

You said you were confused. I pointed out that there are ways to look at it that make perfect sense that don't cast dispersions on the program. It's a pretty simple explanation and generally the simple ones are more likely correct. Why are so many people convinced there is something nefarious going on?

I was simply referring to your protest of people "reading more into this" and then you go on to speculate too.
To clear up my "confusion," I'd like some facts. You provided none, just your version of what might have happened...

 

[jbhtexas]

I never accused anyone (staff or administration) of anything unsavory.

Fine, weasel around with semantics if you like. There is no clear fact or evidence that Jeff Grayer was treated badly, and you admitted that you don't know what went down, yet you said that it appears Grayer was thrown to the scrap heap. Perhaps "baseless conclusion" would be a more fitting term for your statement...

 

[BryceC]

Oh, pardon me, I didn't know that speculation was illegal on this site.

I never accused anyone (staff or administration) of anything unsavory. My ire is typically (and in this case) pointed at the many posters on this site that talk out of both sides of their mouths...ie: Hoiberg is a perfect hire but Grayer has too little coaching experience to be an assistant...that is ridiculous.

Who has said Hoiberg was the perfect hire? He's not the perfect hire, which is why he needs assistants with a lot of experience. That's it that's all.

 

[Cycsk]

My $.02 is that FH and JP were kind enough to give him time to find something else to replace the ISU position first. He found something and resigned. This is how you treat a person you care about.

I would like to hope that it went down like you say. It would show the kind of class that Grayer deserves, even in a very awkward situation for FH.

 

[VeloClone]

I was simply referring to your protest of people "reading more into this" and then you go on to speculate too.
To clear up my "confusion," I'd like some facts. You provided none, just your version of what might have happened...

Here is the post that you quoted:

"Here's my question....why is this happening now? He has been on the coaching staff for three months now, maybe even a little bit more since he was originally hired by McD, and only now the limitations of his position are an issue, right at the start of the semester? I don't know, just doesn't feel right to me."

You said he had good points and you were confused, too. I suggested that there was a simple narrative that would explain it and indicate that what happened was above board. Occams Razor suggests the simplest explanations are most likely. You choose not to subscribe to my suggestion. Fine.

I just wish that our brand new coach, who also happens to be a Cyclone legend just like Grayer, is given the benefit of the doubt. The post you quoted and endorsed did not appear that any benefit of the doubt was given.

If that is not enough for you from me, than I can't help you.

 

[ricochet]

ie: Hoiberg is a perfect hire but Grayer has too little coaching experience to be an assistant...that is ridiculous.

A - nobody (or very few) have said Hoiberg is a perfect hire. B - nobody has said Grayer has too little experience to be an assistant. What people are saying is that maybe it isn't such a good idea to have more than one coach without experience at a time.