Vroman played in the NBA, and that was one of the criteria for being on the list.
All-Century Team
- Thread starter EggMcClone
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Vroman played in the NBA, and that was one of the criteria for being on the list.
from what I've heard of loren meyers post nba career, he probably sold it to him. :baffled5wh:
There is a huge "current day bias" in this sort of voting. Most people (including me) only refer back to their own personal knowledge and exclude anything prior to that. Having said that, 5 of the 7 were easy for me:
Ron Harris - The iron man of ISU basketball and the foundation Orr started his building on.
Jeff Hornacek - A true late bloomer but probably the highest basketball IQ of any player in Cyclone history. Frankly, I don't think he was fully appreciated until he was gone.
Hercle Ivy - This man could score and did so in front of a 75% empty Hilton Coliseum most nights.
Barry Stevens - The best jump shooter in ISU history. He would be significantly higher in the scoring record books had the three point line been in effect when he played.
Dean Uthoff - This man could rebound and did so in front of a 75% empty Hilton Coliseum most nights. Probably the best pure rebounder in school history.
The final two were tough...Sammy Hill, Victor Alexander, and Kelvin Cato all came to mind. However, I went with two "hawkeye killers". Terrence Allen who converted several back door alley oops late in the game against iowa in an overtime (or possibly double OT) win in January of 84 (if I recall correctly). And Lafester Rhodes who dropped 54 on them in December of 87 (you should recall that Lafester had a very good season in total that year).
Ron Harris - The iron man of ISU basketball and the foundation Orr started his building on.
Jeff Hornacek - A true late bloomer but probably the highest basketball IQ of any player in Cyclone history. Frankly, I don't think he was fully appreciated until he was gone.
Hercle Ivy - This man could score and did so in front of a 75% empty Hilton Coliseum most nights.
Barry Stevens - The best jump shooter in ISU history. He would be significantly higher in the scoring record books had the three point line been in effect when he played.
Dean Uthoff - This man could rebound and did so in front of a 75% empty Hilton Coliseum most nights. Probably the best pure rebounder in school history.
The final two were tough...Sammy Hill, Victor Alexander, and Kelvin Cato all came to mind. However, I went with two "hawkeye killers". Terrence Allen who converted several back door alley oops late in the game against iowa in an overtime (or possibly double OT) win in January of 84 (if I recall correctly). And Lafester Rhodes who dropped 54 on them in December of 87 (you should recall that Lafester had a very good season in total that year).
I don't think I voted for anyone that wasn't at ISU for at least 3 seasons. As much as I liked Cato, Willoughby, and Vroman I just couldn't vote for them as there were guys on that list that had 3-4 years of service to ISU and accomplished a lot.
I voted for my 7. The ones I chose were Jeff Hornacek, Barry Stevens, Ron Harris, Andrew Parker, Dean Uthoff, Dedric Willoughby, and Hercle Ivy. Some very hard decisions to make as there are several very worthy candidates who I had to leave off my list.
I think you still have to factor in how a player rated compared to the talent in his era. Just as in any sport, players today very well could be more talented than the eras before them but that's because like most things we have only gotten better with time and advances in technology. Players and coaches didn't have the luxuries of all the ways to analyze players and teams through technology or even the fitness aspect of sports.
Let's go back even to the 1980's NBA. How do you think Larry Bird would rank amongst today's athletes? He was a great player and great shooter but the average basketball player today is probably quicker and more athletic than they were in the 80's and Larry might have a harder time scoring and defending guys like LeBron and Melo.
I looked at it as how many years did the player play, what did they accomplish while they were at ISU and how they rated compared to the competition they played against. Cato while good in his 2 seasons here is hard to compare to some of those guys on the list that played 4 good seasons.
Let's go back even to the 1980's NBA. How do you think Larry Bird would rank amongst today's athletes? He was a great player and great shooter but the average basketball player today is probably quicker and more athletic than they were in the 80's and Larry might have a harder time scoring and defending guys like LeBron and Melo.
I looked at it as how many years did the player play, what did they accomplish while they were at ISU and how they rated compared to the competition they played against. Cato while good in his 2 seasons here is hard to compare to some of those guys on the list that played 4 good seasons.
I don't think Bird would have any trouble being a superstar in today's game at all. With his height and release he could still shoot over the top of anyone guarding him. Michael Redd relies almost completely on his shooting ability and he averages 28 per game. In Birds era you had to play man to man or they called illegal defense so Bird was consistently isolated on Worthy, Julius Erving etc and did just fine. Under todays rules you could provide even more help on his man since zone is legal. Plus Bird had no fear of taking any shot at any time, much like MJ, that wouldn't change. If you want to talk about Bob Cousy being one of the top players in the game today, I think you would have a better case, he would probably just be above average at best. And I don't think that Bob Cousy should be rated ahead of people like Majic Johnson just because of his era.
he was the number 1 priority on defense because there was nobody else to defend. Put him on a good team (IE his freshman year) and he is the 3rd or 4th option to defend which is largely in part as to why he got so many open looks at a 3.
Granted he was a freshman and who knows what he would have been like as a senior on a good team but it is not a 'what if' game. Based on his career as it stands he is not all century material. IMO
Jake had some talent his senior year. They were just young. That NIT team that made it to the semi's was pretty good for a NIT team. I hate Quincy Douby though. He was so annoying to play against. The fans all had the I Douby leave signs it was so stupid. But does anyone remember the 3 that Jake hit to bring that game into OT. The announcers for that game were terrible. They said that Stinson was as good as Tinsley during that game. That team wasn't that bad though.
Yes he belongs, Tinsley is an exception. Hard to look past the 2 teams he played on which were possibly 2 of the best teams ever at ISU plus his personal achievements can't be looked past either. Guys like Cato, Willoughby, and for some reason people mention Pratt (hopefully they are joking) just did not accomplish as much as he did in 2 years and were not all-american selections.
The 8 automatics I don't think you can really argue they don't belong on the list. The remaining list I just think there are more deserving players ahead of guys like Willoughby, Cato, and Vroman who push them just off the list of remaining selections. Here's a tough one to judge too... Cato or Homan. Homan played 4 years and is the all-time leading shot blocker but Cato played 2 years and set that record in 1/2 the time it took Homan to break it. Both made a NCAA tournament and both have pretty nice career achievements to support their case. I wish I had wrote down who I voted for but I'm pretty sure I didn't vote for either of them. They both did a lot while at ISU and while Cato is in the NBA I'm judging strictly on their time at ISU which I think is a near toss-up with possibly a slight edge to Cato just based on the contributions in a shorter time frame.
I was at that game, Rutgers fans make Iowa fans look sophisticated. They're the worst group I've ever seen, edging out UNLV fans. :angry6wn:
Dedrick and Kelvin bailed us out! Just because ISU didn't bring them in as freshman doesn't make them any less basketball greats. How would that floyd team have looked without them?
I'm not saying those 2 guys were not great for our program. I just think that there are guys on that list that were here 4 years that did more for the program.
This is why you get to vote, not everyone is going to agree on the same players. They guys on that list would not be on it if they hadn't done something great at ISU...
This is why you get to vote, not everyone is going to agree on the same players. They guys on that list would not be on it if they hadn't done something great at ISU...
Was it just me, or did anyone else want to write in Hester. I really miss chanting his name at the end of the games. It just seemed fitting for him to be a write-in candidate.
My 7:
Big Vic
Hornacek
Homan - the man is our leading shot blocker people!
Willoughby
Thigpen
Cato
Stevens
My 7:
Big Vic
Hornacek
Homan - the man is our leading shot blocker people!
Willoughby
Thigpen
Cato
Stevens
My vote:
Big Vic
Hornacek
Homan
Ivy
Thigpen
Cato
Stevens
Unfortunately, I don't think we will have a game this year where the 'hester" chant would be used. I almost decided to write his name in the write in spot but I couldn't figure out who to leave off.
Big Vic
Hornacek
Homan
Ivy
Thigpen
Cato
Stevens
Unfortunately, I don't think we will have a game this year where the 'hester" chant would be used. I almost decided to write his name in the write in spot but I couldn't figure out who to leave off.
Maybe someone can do some stats research to create a "case" for this guy but somewhat surprised Jacy Holloway didn't get a mention. He has to be up there in assists and steals and FT% leaders I would think. While I can't endorse him for one of the last spots he was a pretty solid PG that never really did anything flashy but did contribute to some successful teams with his decision making running the PG.