Tough day for EIU hoops hopes

[RezClone]

Agreed. I welcome the idea. Basketball in the state is so much better when both top programs are good. It’s not like we rely on in state recruits that we have to battle Iowa for. There’s really not much downside to Iowa having a competent coaching staff. And maybe Devries isn’t that, but it gives them hope. Which then turns to misery when they fail. Which is equally fun. Fan apathy isn’t fun for the fans or for their rivals.

Yeah, but the product is just not very good. Even when they were good, the elephant in the room was the product was overrated at best. They are not a good watch and never have been. It is is primarily the heavy reliance on iowa kids (this includes moline) that has rendered it so.

This is supposed to be entertainment after all. If we weren't tied to the state of Iowa we probably wouldn't watch either (this is coming from a guy who watches every iowa game. And I do mean every one)

Fred's current Nebraska team is good example. We can debate how good they are, but I objectively enjoy watching them play. Not because of the Fred connection... I simply enjoy watching them play. They have similar goals to Fran's teams and accomplish many of the same things in many of the same ways, and they similarly won't be mistaken for defensive juggernauts any time soon.

The brutally harsh truth is that Fred primarily relies on undersized guys that are athletic. They are athletic enough to hang while making up for their deficiencies on offense. He did this at ISU, too. Fran isn't stupid, and I know he's hoping his rosters can accomplish the same thing. His players are trying to accomplish the same thing.

They simply can't, and even worse the product is just s***. It just is. It's equally funny and frustrating to hear people debate why fans have checked out. Why they won't show up. The fixation on points scored is the biggest crock of cope in local sports history, and nobody wants to call it out. I've always cringed at "Fran's teams play an exciting brand of ball", even when their fate wasn't so obvious earlier on.

I'll tell you why people don't care, whether anyone wants to admit it or not. Turn on any P6 game. Anyone can clearly see what's different from iowa in about 10 seconds. Sorry, but when you cant defend and cant rebound...100 points scored unathleticly by iowa's rotating cast of dorks in a well-oiled gimmick system is one thing, and it is impressive in its own way. But it has never been EXCITING. Never.

 

[BryceC]

My guess is they are hoping to get a McDermott style bailout. Fran senses job security may become an issue and starts looking for another gig, even if it's a lateral move. They get to move on from Fran without the buyout.

He’s in his 60s and making an absolute ton of money.

There is no lateral move that would pay him anything close to the same money. He’s getting that buyout if he’s going anywhere.

 

[Pope]

It’s always funny to see the ages of posters come through (no disrespect). Maury John will always be the class of Drake coaches and people can shout about Coach K being the biggest “what if” in ISU basketball history but man the coup Iowa State pulled off to get him from Drake… it would have been something to see what Maury could have done here.

Wow, that brings back early childhood memories!

Maury was the man! I can recite the Bulldog's entire starting lineup when they lost a close one to John Wooden's UCLA team in the 1969 Final Four. That UCLA team was led by Lew Alcindor (aka Kareem Jabbar). I watched that game on TV as a little kid and cried my eyes out at the end.

It was so sad when Maury passed away from cancer not long after becoming ISU's head coach. Maury's son, John John, played sparingly for Iowa State.

I also remember sitting WAY up in the cheap seats as a kid at the very first game ever played in Hilton in 1971 and watching Maury's Iowa State team beat Arizona. Eric Heft played on that team.

 

[ImJustKCClone]

Yeah, but the product is just not very good. Even when they were good, the elephant in the room was the product was overrated at best. They are not a good watch and never have been. It is is primarily the heavy reliance on iowa kids (this includes moline) that has rendered it so.

This is supposed to be entertainment after all. If we weren't tied to the state of Iowa we probably wouldn't watch either (this is coming from a guy who watches every iowa game. And I do mean every one)

Fred's current Nebraska team is good example. We can debate how good they are, but I objectively enjoy watching them play. Not because of the Fred connection... I simply enjoy watching them play. They have similar goals to Fran's teams and accomplish many of the same things in many of the same ways, and they similarly won't be mistaken for defensive juggernauts any time soon.

The brutally harsh truth is that Fred primarily relies on undersized guys that are athletic. They are athletic enough to hang while making up for their deficiencies on offense. He did this at ISU, too. Fran isn't stupid, and I know he's hoping his rosters can accomplish the same thing. His players are trying to accomplish the same thing.

They simply can't, and even worse the product is just s***. It just is. It's equally funny and frustrating to hear people debate why fans have checked out. Why they won't show up. The fixation on points scored is the biggest crock of cope in local sports history, and nobody wants to call it out. I've always cringed at "Fran's teams play an exciting brand of ball", even when their fate wasn't so obvious earlier on.

I'll tell you why people don't care, whether anyone wants to admit it or not. Turn on any P6 game. Anyone can clearly see what's different from iowa in about 10 seconds. Sorry, but when you cant defend and cant rebound...100 points scored unathleticly by iowa's rotating cast of dorks in a well-oiled gimmick system is one thing, and it is impressive in its own way. But it has never been EXCITING. Never.

I'm not a big fan of shootouts in either basketball OR football; it's pretty boring. But watching MBB games with a combined final point total under 70, or FB with a combined point total under 35 is deadly boring. There's a happy medium, where you see offense and defense from both teams. THOSE are the exciting games. And a reliance on crashing to the basket to draw fouls and scoring 50% of your points off free throws is pretty ugly too (I'm looking at YOU, Iowa).

 

[CycloneVet]

Rebuilding in college basketball is no longer a thing. Look what TJ did his first year after what he took over.

I agree with this. With all options out there for players, having to rebuild is an excuse for shortcomings

 

[madguy30]

I agree with this. With all options out there for players, having to rebuild is an excuse for shortcomings

I give it at least a season for any sort of depth to take hold.

ISU wasn't exactly loaded in 21-22 but were able to jump on people early with how they played and it paid off come Selection Sunday after a rough conference season.

 

[exCYtable]

Frans problems are so similar to Kirk's. HUGE amounts of nepotism, except his are with his players instead of coaches. Huge amounts of stubbornness, and arrogance, and refusal to change: Kirk's with his offense, and Fran with his defense and recruiting strategies. And then you throw in Fran's demeanor on the court. Iowa basketball is famous for Mad Crazy Fran. Iowa football is famous for crap offense. Beth's got her hands full over there.

 

[Dirt Boy 2]

Don’t have to worry about a floor rush at iowa. They are too busy reading.

If Tang and his team stormed the student section in Iowa City, would he run into anyone?

 

[Cydkar]

My opinion is that they’ve gotten so bad and fans are so apathetic they can’t afford to hope an up and coming mid major coach like DeVries will be a homerun. They will need more of a splash hire. Maybe a former power five coach that had success but retired recently and can come in for 2-3 years and groom whoever the long term hire might be.

I think you’d be surprised at how anyone, but the guy who’s already there, will raise interest. Devries would be a decent hire from that aspect anyway.

 

[Cydkar]

They are really in a bind roster wise if Perkins leaves. Will be interesting to see what happens next month.

Perkins could make some good money on the open market.

 

[Gunnerclone]

Yeah, but the product is just not very good. Even when they were good, the elephant in the room was the product was overrated at best. They are not a good watch and never have been. It is is primarily the heavy reliance on iowa kids (this includes moline) that has rendered it so.

This is supposed to be entertainment after all. If we weren't tied to the state of Iowa we probably wouldn't watch either (this is coming from a guy who watches every iowa game. And I do mean every one)

Fred's current Nebraska team is good example. We can debate how good they are, but I objectively enjoy watching them play. Not because of the Fred connection... I simply enjoy watching them play. They have similar goals to Fran's teams and accomplish many of the same things in many of the same ways, and they similarly won't be mistaken for defensive juggernauts any time soon.

The brutally harsh truth is that Fred primarily relies on undersized guys that are athletic. They are athletic enough to hang while making up for their deficiencies on offense. He did this at ISU, too. Fran isn't stupid, and I know he's hoping his rosters can accomplish the same thing. His players are trying to accomplish the same thing.

They simply can't, and even worse the product is just s***. It just is. It's equally funny and frustrating to hear people debate why fans have checked out. Why they won't show up. The fixation on points scored is the biggest crock of cope in local sports history, and nobody wants to call it out. I've always cringed at "Fran's teams play an exciting brand of ball", even when their fate wasn't so obvious earlier on.

I'll tell you why people don't care, whether anyone wants to admit it or not. Turn on any P6 game. Anyone can clearly see what's different from iowa in about 10 seconds. Sorry, but when you cant defend and cant rebound...100 points scored unathleticly by iowa's rotating cast of dorks in a well-oiled gimmick system is one thing, and it is impressive in its own way. But it has never been EXCITING. Never.

Points scored is dumb American personified. Get with the analytics.

 

[Jdk]

I think you’d be surprised at how anyone, but the guy who’s already there, will raise interest. Devries would be a decent hire from that aspect anyway.

Why would Devries leave a winning program like drake and inherit that dumpster fire at Iowa, I know your looking at more $$ than he is earning now but is the heartache worth it.

 

[GoHawks]

Why would Devries leave a winning program like drake and inherit that dumpster fire at Iowa, I know your looking at more $$ than he is earning now but is the heartache worth it.

Same reason TJ wanted to take over a 2-22 team. Iowa and Iowa State are better jobs, more opportunities, more money. Drake will probably go something like 26-8 this year and play in the NIT

 

[AuH2O]

Why would he walk away? He has been there 14 seasons, and has a contract that runs through the 2027/28 season and is currently making 3.3 million a year, the last year of the deal he will be making 3.7 million. No coach is going to walk away from that much money.

Fran McCaffery signs contract extension with Iowa through 2027-28 season

McCaffery will be 68 years old when his latest contract extension expires.

www.hawkcentral.com

Fran has checked out. If his youngest has a chance to play at ND I think he’d negotiate down a buyout.

The only opposite to that is in all seriousness years of having your kids play and all the stress and criticism that comes with it have to wear on a coach and parent. Maybe he will be energized to just coach without that noise.

 

[madguy30]

Same reason TJ wanted to take over a 2-22 team. Iowa and Iowa State are better jobs, more opportunities, more money. Drake will probably go something like 26-8 this year and play in the NIT

Does Devries have strong ties to Iowa including being an assistant coach there?

Pretty sure TJ wanted the job in 2015 when things were going very well for ISU.

 

[SEIOWA CLONE]

Fran has checked out. If his youngest has a chance to play at ND I think he’d negotiate down a buyout.

The only opposite to that is in all seriousness years of having your kids play and all the stress and criticism that comes with it have to wear on a coach and parent. Maybe he will be energized to just coach without that noise.

Why would Fran want a buyout when his youngest son is only a junior in HS, and there has been talk that he may go the prep school route for a year if he does not get a college offer, he likes. Fran is getting hell because he has played his kids in front of better players and their fans can see it. If there is any stress there, it's because he put it there.

 

[Drew0311]

I’m not sure anyone can do anything with Iowa basketball in this era. Iowa has made it clear they are spending their NIL in football. That’s why no good transfers will give them the time of day. That’s not Frans fault to be honest. The next coach is walking into no support from NIL. It seems with schools like Iowa state and Iowa that you have to pick a sport and hope for the best in the other sport. The rich schools can afford both sports for NIL

 

[AuH2O]

Why would Fran want a buyout when his youngest son is only a junior in HS, and there has been talk that he may go the prep school route for a year if he does not get a college offer, he likes. Fran is getting hell because he has played his kids in front of better players and their fans can see it. If there is any stress there, it's because he put it there.

I think he’d wait until his youngest is in college, but I don’t think he’s riding out his whole contract.

 

[HFCS]

I have to think Iowa uses the unlimited tv money in 2025 to buy out the rest of Fran’s contract after next season. They’ve waisted an entire generation of mbb fandom on the guy.

 

[HFCS]

I’m not sure anyone can do anything with Iowa basketball in this era. Iowa has made it clear they are spending their NIL in football. That’s why no good transfers will give them the time of day. That’s not Frans fault to be honest. The next coach is walking into no support from NIL. It seems with schools like Iowa state and Iowa that you have to pick a sport and hope for the best in the other sport. The rich schools can afford both sports for NIL

Fran was failing with his transfer targets before NIL. I’d agree nil doesn’t help an already bad transfer recruiter.

I think Fran should have slowed their pace this year because his best transfer excels in a slow game but sucks in a fast paced game.