F*CK IOWA
- Thread starter FallOf81
- Start date
Invalid signal means the play is dead once either team touches the ball
The officials literally said, they saw the possible invalid fair catch, but decided to wait and not blow play dead, because it is a reviewable play and they could review to make positive call.
Why cant people understand this.
Except the fair catch guidelines are the same for both Punt and kick, just where the ball is spotted after said fair catch is different.
Is the dude wearing a shirt that says I Love Ho Moms?
If fumbling a ball is such a simple rule, why do officials not whistle the play dead if they think it is a fumble?
If catching the ball is a simple rule, why do officials miss the call?
If stepping out of bounds is a simple rule, why do officials need replay?
Officials are human. They make mistakes. That’s why we have replay. Another official can step in and say “we need to look at this again.” And guess what? They get the call RIGHT
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And on certain calls, when the consequences of blowing it dead are huge (such as a fumble, or a return like this) if a ref isn't 100% positive it is better to let it play out and go to review.
Flip it around: Lets say he didn't actually make an invalid signal but a ref thought he mightve. The ref blows it dead a few seconds after Dejean fields the ball, but enough for the fans to see he had an open path downfield for a TD. Review of it shows he should have been allowed to field it but its too late to fix the error. Iowa throws an interception on the next play and loses. Iowa fans would be livid that the potential game-winning play wasn't allowed to play out because the ref blew the whistle early.
If DeJean had caught that punt, instead of letting it hit the ground... could he have advanced it? If not, then it doesn't matter at all if you wave your hand above your head or not... right?
I thought this invalid catch rule was only for punts that hit the ground first.
I thought this invalid catch rule was only for punts that hit the ground first.
How is having a ref make 2 judgement calls (is the hand waving and is the hand above the head) easier than 1 judgement call (is the hand waving)? I wouldn't be surprised if the current rule is the result of a change to an older rule just to make it easier on the refs.
Best part of KXNO morning rush is you got the trifecta: complaining about Kirk, complaining about Brian and complaining about refs. And for the bonus, you got complaints about Barta. That pretty well sums up the Hok fandom. Also, I learned that if every Big 10 OC had to abide by Brian’s contract, only four would keep their job (for points in Big 10 conference games only).
No. It doesn't matter if it bounces. As soon as he waved his hand, it's a dead ball as soon as Iowa fields it or Minnesota touches it. The only exception would be if there was a fumble (either DeJean muffing it or it touching another Iowa player).
And this is exactly why the invalid fair catch rule is in there. Players previously would occasionally make a fair catch signal that wasn't over the head so it wasn't a valid signal and the officials knew it but the other team may not and would let up giving an unfair advantage to the return team.
Some Hok fans are saying "Then Minnesota should be penalized 15 yards for hitting a player that signaled for a fair catch!"
Umm.... no. The rulebook has a specific example for this. In fact, Iowa is lucky this 5 yard penalty was never assessed. Probably can't since it went to review.
Umm.... no. The rulebook has a specific example for this. In fact, Iowa is lucky this 5 yard penalty was never assessed. Probably can't since it went to review.
No, the call was "invalid fair catch" which is about the signal for fair catch. The think people need to understand, There are 3 types. No signal, ball can be caught and advanced as normal. Valid Fair Catch, ball can be caught and dead at spot of catch. Invalid fair catch, anytime ball is touched by either team, ball dead at spot. Once a fair catch signal is called valid or invalid, the ball is dead when receiver touches it.
I believe a couple years ago, I saw a play where the receiver made an invalid fair catch signal, then touched the ball but DID NOT grab it, and the other team jumped on it, thinking they got a muff punt. But the rule came down that because of the invalid fair catch signal the ball was down the instant the receiving team touched it, and was given to the receiving team at that spot.
For some reason I believe that was in an ISU game, and people were upset but it didnt get near the traction as this. People realized that was the rule and it was over.
People at that time if I remember thought it was dumb, why not just always call an invalid fair catch, signal, so you never worry about muffs, but for some reason that was not practical I guess. But I am not sure I remember the exact scenario right.
In that case I dont know if just touching it vs possessing it makes a difference to the rules, but I have read directly in the rules where it says "anytime there is an invalid fair catch signal, the ball is dead when either team TOUCHES it."
So take it for what it is, meaning, once that fair catch or invalid fair catch signal is given, the ball can not be advanced, period, regardless if it is in air or bouncing. How it officially is down whether actually possession or just Touching is questionable. similar to when the kicking team downs the ball, usually they make you actually grab it, not just slap it/touch it to officially down it.
KidSilverhair
Well-Known Member
Actually, if the kicking team is the first one to touch a punt, it’s technically a penalty (illegal touching) with the penalty being the receiving team gets the ball at the point it was first touched. The reason officials let the ball roll/bounce until it stops is because the return team always has the right to grab the ball and try a return, even after it’s been touched by the kicking team (invalid fair catch signals excepted).
(This is also why the argument that punts are ‘dead balls’ is silly; even after being touched by the kicking team, the return team has the right to try to return it until the officials whistle it dead once it stops moving. Again, invalid fair catch signals excluded.)
This is why you very rarely see a returner grab a rolling/bouncing punt after it’s been touched by the kicking team and try to return it (maybe after bouncing off a foot or something). The upside is you might get a decent return, which counts; but even if you lose yardage or fumble on the attempted return, the receiving team can elect to take possession at the point where it was touched.
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On KCRG in CR just a few minutes ago... they asked both Marvin McNutt and Scott Dochtermann about it... and they looked like fools.
McNutt said it was a horrible call and that DeJean's hand was nowhere near above his head. No s**t idiot... you still have no idea what was called 2 days later? Get a clue buddy.
And Dochtermann talked about when he used to run, a long time ago, he flailed his arms too. OMG! You seriously believe that's how DeJean Cooper runs? We've all seen him run a LOT this season Scott.... and he looks nothing like that.
These people are seriously deranged. They CANNOT just accept that Iowa lost a football game fair and square to Minnesota and PJ Fleck. The arrogance is so off the charts.
McNutt said it was a horrible call and that DeJean's hand was nowhere near above his head. No s**t idiot... you still have no idea what was called 2 days later? Get a clue buddy.
And Dochtermann talked about when he used to run, a long time ago, he flailed his arms too. OMG! You seriously believe that's how DeJean Cooper runs? We've all seen him run a LOT this season Scott.... and he looks nothing like that.
These people are seriously deranged. They CANNOT just accept that Iowa lost a football game fair and square to Minnesota and PJ Fleck. The arrogance is so off the charts.