WWJD- What Will Jamie Do?

[jpete24]

I would rather pay Fred bigger bucks to have a great bball team than to stash millions to buy out Paul.

28 wins in bball >>4-5 wins in fball at this point.

This x1,000,000. Jesus, Hoiberg at this point should be the second highest paid coach in the Big 12, because he's proven again and again he's probably the second best coach in the Big 12! I could even debate him being a better coach than Bill Self, but I'll digress. PAY HIM, make the money issue truly impossible to leave this job. You give him enough money he'd have to ask himself why he'd leave for same money, more risk and more stress.

I've said it time and time again, if we find out as a fan base that Hoiberg could have stayed if more money was on the table, Jamie Pollard would be packing his bags.......meltdown city.

 

[RubyClone]

And then when Hoiberg doesn't perform like a Top 2 coach, you are going to complain about Pollard's terrible contract he gave Hoiberg.

I can't see any rational reasons, other than emotional attachment, why we should make Fred Hoiberg a Top 5 paid coach with his resume. I love the program's trajectory but no way should he make as much as Bill Self ($4.7m), or more than Tom Izzo ($4m), Sean Miller ($3.4), or Bo Ryan ($2.9).

Hoiberg was the 21st highest paid coach last year. He will move into the Top 15 in the coming years. He has ONE Sweet 16 appearance and ZERO regular season conference titles. Why should we pay him like he has Final Fours and National Titles? Maybe in 5-7 years, but definitely not now.

You're rationale is sound overall. I don't see a reason to make a top 5 paid head coach above the names you listed either. But he HAS brought unprecedented success to ISU, last years flameout not withstanding. Fastest in number of wins, 2 tourney titles, 4 NCAAs. I do think 3MM+ isn't out of line - IF it helps keep him here.

But... 1) I'd bet an extension and/or raise is on his table to be had as we speak. He's just not going to sign then run a week later. But if by some miracle he does stay, pretty likely a new deal will be part of the announcement. and 2) I don't think money is the overall motivator for Fred. He want's to try his hand at the highest level. This isn't about money (but it never hurts to make that aspect less of a selling point)

 

[Gunnerclone]

This x1,000,000. Jesus, Hoiberg at this point should be the second highest paid coach in the Big 12, because he's proven again and again he's probably the second best coach in the Big 12! I could even debate him being a better coach than Bill Self, but I'll digress. PAY HIM, make the money issue truly impossible to leave this job. You give him enough money he'd have to ask himself why he'd leave for same money, more risk and more stress.

I've said it time and time again, if we find out as a fan base that Hoiberg could have stayed if more money was on the table, Jamie Pollard would be packing his bags.......meltdown city.

We've already found out this isn't the case so don't hold your breath.

 

[RotatingColumn]

Yep gotta go all in on Hoiball. Having a decent football season has and always will be an added bonus at ISU. It should not be our primary focus to try to build football into something it hasn't been in 100 years.

 

[HornacekFan1414]

That is pretty hard to argue with. I don't get the Hornacek buzz at all. We already went way high risk with Hoiberg and it might be time for something way less risky. I am getting more and more in line with those who think TJ is the guy. If not it needs to be a proven coach that can recruit Big 12 level players. If it is not TJ than it needs to be a total no-brainer homerun hire that will get people to stand up and notice.

I am fine with TJ, but for someone to say they don't get Hornacek buzz is mind blowing....He runs an even faster pace offense than Fred, is thought of as one of the top shooting coaches in the world, and is an ISU legend....it would keep the momentum and profile at ISU with the media, and fans would be all in....

 

[RubyClone]

I am fine with TJ, but for someone to say they don't get Hornacek buzz is mind blowing....He runs an even faster pace offense than Fred, is thought of as one of the top shooting coaches in the world, and is an ISU legend....it would keep the momentum and profile at ISU with the media, and fans would be all in....

Agreed. I don't know that Hornacek is the answer, nor do I hold anything against TJ. But to summarily dismiss Jeff because he doesn't have college experience and/or we "lucked" out with Fred's lack of, is ludicrous. What made/makes Fred successful is exactly his NBA experience and perhaps the fact he isn't clouded BY college experience. Every game, we hear again and again and again about Fred's NBA experience and the pro sets ISU runs. Seems to me the EXACT person we should be chasing is an NBA person. All the better with ISU ties.

 

[CycloneErik]

That is pretty hard to argue with. I don't get the Hornacek buzz at all. We already went way high risk with Hoiberg and it might be time for something way less risky. I am getting more and more in line with those who think TJ is the guy. If not it needs to be a proven coach that can recruit Big 12 level players. If it is not TJ than it needs to be a total no-brainer homerun hire that will get people to stand up and notice.

TJ barely gets coaching interviews, much less head coaching experience. Great recruiter, but tremendous risk as a head coach.

Hornacek had a pretty rough Suns team in playoff contention until late in the season. If I remember correctly, they weren't supposed to be that good. Sure, Golden State would have wiped them out in the first round anyway, but he had that team playing well.

 

[CycloneErik]

I am fine with TJ, but for someone to say they don't get Hornacek buzz is mind blowing....He runs an even faster pace offense than Fred, is thought of as one of the top shooting coaches in the world, and is an ISU legend....it would keep the momentum and profile at ISU with the media, and fans would be all in....

And, speaking as Hoiberg apologist for about anything: as nice an NBA career as Fred had, Hornacek has to be considered the better professional player. Even if we eliminate the Phoenix and Philly years, those years in Utah with Stockton are outstanding. He'd have a nice reputation to throw around, and plenty of connections as well.

Fred's still my top choice. We know he's outstanding. I have no doubt that Hornacek would step right in and excel as well.

 

[RandyMarsh4pres]

You think stealing a sitting NBA coach to coach to come to Iowa State is high risk? And you'd rather go with a young assistant coach with no head coaching experience? That makes no sense to me.

Hiring an NBA coach is a no-brainer to me.

I agree. Hire Hornacek and keep TJ for recruiting. Hornacek is considered one of the up and coming young NBA coaches. People on here seem to not remember that before the All-Star Break the Suns looked like a team heading into the playoffs with a winning record. Then, right before the trade deadline they traded big contributors like Dragic and Thomas plus Plumlee, Ennis and the younger Dragic. No matter how good a coach is, it is extremely tough to produce a winning product when your team is completely renovated so late in the season. Obviously the season ended badly for the Suns following the trade but as I have shown it is obviously not all on the shoulders of Hornacek. Instead it was more on the shoulders of the Front Office.

The question is not whether he is qualified but whether he would come here or not. Why come here? He may get a raise and a longer deal if he came here instead of stay at Phoenix. Plus he only has one year left on his contract right now and he may want more security instead of having to deal with management that destroyed the season last year. But even if he did come on the market NBA teams would want him too. He is a top coach.

Hornacek has over achieved at Phoenix and more than qualified to coach this team. He has found ways to win even with the Suns signing 3 top point guards (which started the trouble leading up to the trade debacle). He likes to run and score and is considered an up and coming coach in the NBA. Keep TJ for recruiting and we have a solid duo. I just don't know if we could pry him out of the NBA.

 

[FiredUpCyclone]

And, speaking as Hoiberg apologist for about anything: as nice an NBA career as Fred had, Hornacek has to be considered the better professional player. Even if we eliminate the Phoenix and Philly years, those years in Utah with Stockton are outstanding. He'd have a nice reputation to throw around, and plenty of connections as well.

Fred's still my top choice. We know he's outstanding. I have no doubt that Hornacek would step right in and excel as well.

Hornacek was actually an all-star one year, and did play in the NBA Finals. He was earning $6 million per season with his last contract, so he would definitely have immense credibility from an NBA perspective. Regarding Fred, he makes more now as a coach than he ever did as a player in the NBA. His last contract with the Wolves was for $1.5 or $1.75 million annually. He was an NBA role player for the most part whereas Hornacek was a bonafide NBA starter for 10+ years. I believe Hornacek married someone from Iowa, so at least there is a connection to the area beyond his ISU days. Hornacek held Johnny in very high of regard as well. Regardless, lets all hope Fred decides to forgo the NBA for a few more years.

 

[ILikeCy]

You think stealing a sitting NBA coach to coach to come to Iowa State is high risk? And you'd rather go with a young assistant coach with no head coaching experience? That makes no sense to me.

Hiring an NBA coach is a no-brainer to me.

This is an intriguing thought...to focus on NBA backgrounds. Are there any names out there in the NBA that might consider ISU (if we can't get Hornacek)? I'm thinking either former head coaches that have been unemployed for awhile, or maybe some assistant coaches that might be ready to jump to a head coaching job, even if it means leaving the NBA for the college ranks?

 

[Haverhill]

I like the sound of Tad Boyle as well, if we have to hire a new coach.

 

[Stormin]

You're rationale is sound overall. I don't see a reason to make a top 5 paid head coach above the names you listed either. But he HAS brought unprecedented success to ISU, last years flameout not withstanding. Fastest in number of wins, 2 tourney titles, 4 NCAAs. I do think 3MM+ isn't out of line - IF it helps keep him here.

But... 1) I'd bet an extension and/or raise is on his table to be had as we speak. He's just not going to sign then run a week later. But if by some miracle he does stay, pretty likely a new deal will be part of the announcement. and 2) I don't think money is the overall motivator for Fred. He want's to try his hand at the highest level. This isn't about money (but it never hurts to make that aspect less of a selling point)

Do you know the meaning of the word "unprecedented"???? Good grief.

I don't think you do. We have a Sweet Sixteen Finish under Fred which is the best he has done. IIRC, LE had 2 regular season championships in a row along with a Big 12 Tourney Title and an Elite 8 not so long ago. Johnny Orr had a Sweet Sixteen team. Tim Floyd had a Big 8 Tourney Title and another team that was a Sweet Sixteen team.

Fred's done a great job. But there is more work to be done. And the team's accomplishments are not unprecedented.

 

[CycloneErik]

Do you know the meaning of the word "unprecedented"???? Good grief.

I don't think you do. We have a Sweet Sixteen Finish under Fred which is the best he has done. IIRC, LE had 2 regular season championships in a row along with a Big 12 Tourney Title and an Elite 8 not so long ago. Johnny Orr had a Sweet Sixteen team. Tim Floyd had a Big 8 Tourney Title and another team that was a Sweet Sixteen team.

Fred's done a great job. But there is more work to be done. And the team's accomplishments are not unprecedented.

You're missing important facts again. Fred has an unprecedented run going here:
1. Four consecutive NCAA appearances. Never done here before.
2. 23 wins for four straight years. Never done here before.
3. Consecutive Big 12 Tournament championships. Never done here before.

There are still things left for him to do, but ISU has never sustained 4 consecutive years like the last 4 at any point in our history. Even just scratching the surface like this post did, that's an unprecedented run.

 

[Dingus]

You're missing important facts again. Fred has an unprecedented run going here:
1. Four consecutive NCAA appearances. Never done here before.
2. 23 wins for four straight years. Never done here before.
3. Consecutive Big 12 Tournament championships. Never done here before.

There are still things left for him to do, but ISU has never sustained 4 consecutive years like the last 4 at any point in our history. Even just scratching the surface like this post did, that's an unprecedented run.

All true, but that's a bunch of very good, not too much specifically 'great' in there.

 

[CycloneErik]

All true, but that's a bunch of very good, not too much specifically 'great' in there.

It's ISU great.
If it were a program with more history, I'd completely agree. As it is, there's still a way to go to hit great overall, but it's great for what we've been.

 

[Cyclonesince78]

Right or wrong, what happens today could ultimately decide Jamie Pollard's future at Iowa State.

bump

 

[rochclone]

The longevity of success that Fred has had is unmatched in Iowa State's history. There have been higher points with LE but never 4-5 seasons with NCAA tournament appearances.

And Tad Bolye would be crazy to not jump at the opportunity to move to Iowa State. Colorado will never have the support in basketball that Iowa State does. Decent with X's and O's and has ties to the Midwest. Certainly not afraid of rebuilding project which could be on the horizon in 16-17.

 

[CycloneErik]

The longevity of success that Fred has had is unmatched in Iowa State's history. There have been higher points with LE but never 4-5 seasons with NCAA tournament appearances.

And Tad Bolye would be crazy to not jump at the opportunity to move to Iowa State. Colorado will never have the support in basketball that Iowa State does. Decent with X's and O's and has ties to the Midwest. Certainly not afraid of rebuilding project which could be on the horizon in 16-17.

He also has a win over Kansas, which wins some of us over pretty quickly.
Yes, it's shallow on my part, but it gets some attention and I love beating Kansas.

 

[Cyclonesince78]

To those that say it's not about the money with Fred, just stop. It may not be only about the money, but it's definitely about the money. It's always about the money.