Realignment Megathread (All The Moves)

[2speedy1]

Frank the Tank is at the level of Mhver3. I want links to the contract, not some commentary.

LMAO

What statement did you want a receipt on? I already said without the actual contract that its all guess work. Which, btw, is the same thing you are doing.

I dont think you know who he is.

 

[Gorm]

Like i said looking at other contracts gives you an idea how these things are written. And many are written very similar, if not almost carbon copies. But I guess we could go with your purple unicorn scenarios that you can not produce a single relevant link or contract that would allow for or even dream up such things.

"Looking at other contracts" - Guessing at what may or may not be in a contract based off of similar ones will just lead to false impressions. Link to the actual contract or continue to guess.

You just say oh those links dont make sense, those would be hard to prove in court.

I do not care what some glorified sports blogger thinks might happen in the SEC based off his reading of the Big 12's documents.

No one would have a claim. Like BC would not have a claim if they are left out. Like the other members would not pull the voting rights of the members leaving immediately just like the b12 did for OuT.

Schools left out might have a claim. Would they want to go through years of litagation and likely lots of dirty laundry coming up at discovery? Not so sure. Plus their former conference partners would likely support their new conference against the former members.

Waiting for your links....

Guess you missed the last line, or maybe its just a reading comprehension issue, so I'll repeat:

What statement did you want a receipt on? I already said without the actual contract that its all guess work. Which, btw, is the same thing you are doing.

 

[AuH2O]

Tough to prove in court. Also, who would be bringing the suit if the ACC dissolves?

The teams that will be left out.

It’s easy to say the ACC will dissolve and these teams go to the Big 10, these go to the SEC, these go to the Big 12, etc. But ultimately to get a dissolution you’d need these other conferences, which includes competing media partners, to all agree at the same time. That sure smells like collusion, with quantifiable damages to teams left out.

Also, the conferences have contracts set. That means that move has to make existing conference teams money. In other words, the media partners one way or another are going to escalate media deals around the current per team payouts for each addition, or the conferences won’t agree. They can just wait.

Lastly, for a much smaller price tag, ESPN was not willing to pony up a ton of cash to get much higher value teams in OU and UT out right away, and that despite moving them from a conference they had shared rights to, and move them to one for which they had sole rights.

 

[Gorm]

I dont think you know who he is.

His reputation on other fan sites over the years puts him at guesswork level of Mhver3.

But feel free to enlighten us on what you know of him.

 

[2speedy1]

Under the ACC dissolution strategy he laid out, every ACC school would economically win out being in their new conference vs. the ACC. At least through 2036 when the GOR expires.

• The 6-8 ACC schools going to the Big10 or SEC stand to make $600M more between now and 2036. Plus you have Notre Dame likely going to Big10 if ACC dissolves.
• The ACC schools going to the Big12 could make more than they currently make in the ACC. Big12 schools will make and average of $31.7 and the ACC deal is below that.
• ACC schools that join a G5 conference will make less than their current ACC deal, but...

Why wouldn't Clemson, FSU, UNC, etc. each take $600M more over the next 12 years from the SEC/Big10 and turnaround and each give $200M (or whatever the amount is) to make ACC schools left out whole plus a kicker vs. their current ACC deal?

If all 14 ACC schools can be richer than the current ACC TV deal between now & 2036- why not do the deal? Basically, the same logic as the Pac12. Why delay the inevitable and in this case the schools not being invited to the Big10/SEC hold great cards.

How do you believe that all members of the ACC land in a new and better conference?

How do you think the B1G will take 6-8 teams from the ACC? The most anyone I have ever seen believes it would be 4 max to the B1G and 4 max to the SEC. The big 12 will probably not take all the rest.

Find me a G5 conference that makes as much as the ACC?

The MT West I believe is the highest paying G5 currently and they make a little less than $4M per team from media.

Edit: I see you said 6-8 to the combined B1G and SEC, I read it too fast the first time as 6-8 to b1g alone. my other point still stands.

 

[2speedy1]

His reputation on other fan sites over the years puts him at guesswork level of Mhver3.

But feel free to enlighten us on what you know of him.

Still waiting on your links with better info.....that proves any of mine wrong.

 

[Gorm]

Still waiting on your links with better info.....that proves any of mine wrong.

I don't have any...that is why I asked you for yours

I'd be happy to eat crow upon reading what the actual contract stipulates.

I will say that asking for a "link" from someone who already asked you for that link is a bold strategy.

 

[2speedy1]

I don't have any...that is why I asked you for yours

Exactly what I thought.

 

[isucy86]

Oh boy.

Ok ESPN owns all the rights. If the SEC adds more inventory ESPN owns those rights. They don’t have to pay anything more unless there is an escalator clause that I’m sure ESPN has to agree to. So again ESPN would be bidding against itself.

But do you think Texas & OU went to the SEC without ESPN approving? ESPN was bidding against itself (SEC per school vs. Big12 per school). I guarantee the SEC had a handshake deal ESPN would pony up a prorata even if it wasn't in the existing contract. Did ESPN count on the Big12 folding so it ended their Big12 investment early? That's what Bowlsby inferred.

 

[Gorm]

Exactly what I thought.

Think whatever you need to.

Still waiting on the link that supporting your "guess" as to what is happening.

Otherwise, you and me are in the same spot, making "guesses" as to what might happen.

 

[isucy86]

I'm completely guessing, just like you. I'd love to see the contract so I know exactly whats in it.

Agreed. Link?

So the SEC is going to expand and give ESPN free inventory. LMAO.
We don't know the pro rata details becuase we don't know the contract. It is anyone's guess as to what might or might not happen.

Once again, anyone's guess without seeing the contract.

The Double Fries guy linked the ACC GOR documents in the description to his Vlog. But not a lot there.

 

[2speedy1]

I don't have any...that is why I asked you for yours

I'd be happy to eat crow upon reading what the actual contract stipulates.

I will say that asking for a "link" from someone who already asked you for that link is a bold strategy.

I gave you several and you gave 0 that disprove any of mine. You have yet to show that the SEC contract would be drastically different for other conferences media deals, GoRs etc.

All you can say is the one "would be hard to prove in court" When it does get proven and has actual Case Law. One you dont like the other link because you want to discredit him, even though he quotes several distinct contract sections in his blog. And just say hes a MhVer3 type person. And finally you say the B12 contract is not proof of how these things are written, yet you give no alternatives to prove other contracts are drastically different.

Hell you dont even give links to sites/posters that speculate anything like what you are saying, but continue to troll about wanting more links.

Tell me you have never signed a contract or even read one, without telling me....

 

[2speedy1]

The Double Fries guy linked the ACC GOR documents in the description to his Vlog. But not a lot there.

Shh...he wont read it or even look. He just wants to stay on his troll that he is right. God forbid he actually tries reading or researching.

 

[exCyDing]

Under the ACC dissolution strategy he laid out, every ACC school would economically win out being in their new conference vs. the ACC. At least through 2036 when the GOR expires.

• The 6-8 ACC schools going to the Big10 or SEC stand to make $600M more between now and 2036. Plus you have Notre Dame likely going to Big10 if ACC dissolves.
• The ACC schools going to the Big12 could make more than they currently make in the ACC. Big12 schools will make and average of $31.7 and the ACC deal is below that.
• ACC schools that join a G5 conference will make less than their current ACC deal, but...

Why wouldn't Clemson, FSU, UNC, etc. each take $600M more over the next 12 years from the SEC/Big10 and turnaround and each give $200M (or whatever the amount is) to make ACC schools left out whole plus a kicker vs. their current ACC deal?

If all 14 ACC schools can be richer than the current ACC TV deal between now & 2036- why not do the deal? Basically, the same logic as the Pac12. Why delay the inevitable and in this case the schools not being invited to the Big10/SEC hold great cards.

Because there are going to be schools that think (hope) they can level up before 2031 or 2036. BC getting left out? Maybe they can earn that B12 invite. SEC passes on VATech? Maybe they’re not fated to go to the B12.

Someone going to the B12 is probably going to stick there for the foreseeable future. Someone outside the P3 is probably stuck there.

Let’s not forget - maybe ND wants to remain independent in FB for now and decides the ACC > Big East for their other sports. Being ND, money isn’t the only thing. Maybe they want to stick it to the B10 for some **** from 80 years ago or the SEC for just for funsies and respond to every “how much?” with “not interested.”

 

[Gorm]

I gave you several and you gave 0 that disprove any of mine. You have yet to show that the SEC contract would be drastically different for other conferences media deals, GoRs etc.

I asked for a link to the SEC / ESPN contract. - Show me the post where you have provided this and I'll eat crow.

All you can say is the one "would be hard to prove in court" When it does get proven and has actual Case Law. One you dont like the other link because you want to discredit him, even though he quotes several distinct contract sections in his blog. And just say hes a MhVer3 type person. And finally you say the B12 contract is not proof of how these things are written, yet you give no alternatives to prove other contracts are drastically different.

There is case law that involves a GOR? Hate to say this, but gonna need a link on that claim.
I said the Big 12 contract is NOT the SEC / ESPN contract. That is the only one that matters in this conversation.

Hell you dont even give links to sites/posters that speculate anything like what you are saying, but continue to troll about wanting more links.

I do not have a link to the SEC / ESPN contract. This is why I am asking for one.

Tell me you have never signed a contract or even read one, without telling me....

 

[Gorm]

Shh...he wont read it or even look. He just wants to stay on his troll that he is right. God forbid he actually tries reading or researching.

So the ACC GOR is the SEC / ESPN contract. Well hell, I'll go take a look now that I know that.

 

[WhoISthis]

Under the ACC dissolution strategy he laid out, every ACC school would economically win out being in their new conference vs. the ACC. At least through 2036 when the GOR expires.

• The 6-8 ACC schools going to the Big10 or SEC stand to make $600M more between now and 2036. Plus you have Notre Dame likely going to Big10 if ACC dissolves.
• The ACC schools going to the Big12 could make more than they currently make in the ACC. Big12 schools will make and average of $31.7 and the ACC deal is below that.
• ACC schools that join a G5 conference will make less than their current ACC deal, but...

Why wouldn't Clemson, FSU, UNC, etc. each take $600M more over the next 12 years from the SEC/Big10 and turnaround and each give $200M (or whatever the amount is) to make ACC schools left out whole plus a kicker vs. their current ACC deal?

If all 14 ACC schools can be richer than the current ACC TV deal between now & 2036- why not do the deal? Basically, the same logic as the Pac12. Why delay the inevitable and in this case the schools not being invited to the Big10/SEC hold great cards.

No doubt Yormark is pushing for this, and likely a reason why he wanted to be the conference with both major network as benefactors, something he just championed.

The win-win Yormark has positioned us for was for the Big 12 to provide a landing spot the two networks could use to continue consolidation. Likely that factored into what seemed like a below market rate, which in essence was Yormark “buying” stability via undercutting PAC and ACC demands.

In exchange for helping ESPN and Fox further consolidation, which frees up the valuable linear bandwidth tied up in ACC for a premium SEC plus FSU, Clemson, UNC etc, the Big 12 is bestowed as #3, a cost-effective write off for the networks to avoid litigation. If we’re lucky we get a little more bandwidth too

Adding whatever is needed to liquidate ACC is an easy decision for the Big 12. It basically extends the Big 12’s deal to 2036, removes the cannibalism of scraps after P2, better CFP macros, builds up the basketball inventory via tapping into Big East bloodlines and ACC history, brings conference network revenue, etc

imo the only question is not whether it can be done from ACC schools or networks standpoint, but whether BIG or SEC are ready to go to 20+

Unlike Big 12 , PAC, and ACC, the P2 are partners with networks. They have final say.

I’d guess BIG is ready for at least 18 if it includes ND. Likely 20
SEC would probably follow

 

[nfrine]

Came here looking for news. Ran into a pi**ing match. Some folks need to be given a break from CF...

 

[2speedy1]

So the ACC GOR is the SEC / ESPN contract. Well hell, I'll go take a look now that I know that.

You think all of these contracts are different? They are all almost carbon copies of each other. But you do you.

Staples: How would a school challenge a grant of rights? We asked a lawyer (who happens to have ACC, Big 12, Pac-12 copies)

There are four ways to challenge such a deal. Most of them involve a lot of money and patience.

theathletic.com

"What’s also similar is the language in the original ACC agreement compared to the language in the Big 12 agreement forged a year earlier. Several passages appear to be copied verbatim. This includes a key section titled “Miscellaneous” in each that likely would be of particular interest to anyone wishing to break the agreement."

Maybe you can give me a link to prove the SEC contracts are drastically different than every other conferences.

By the way there is direct links to 3 conferences GORs here among other receipts in this article. Read a few.

 

[Clonedogg]

Put it this way.. do you think Louisville and Pitt would be happy to let Clemson go get an $80M payday while they get a 32M one? Just because they have a landing spot doesnt mean they are going to be happy how the other schools went about it, and made bank while they were left behind. Let alone a school like BC that probably dont have a spot. There would be several lawsuits in play.

I have not read every thing yet on pg 699.

But the problem with this guys 4+4 idea is...Why would the lower four want to help the top four make lots and lots of money, meanwhile the lower 4 only get what they were going to get anyway. What's in it for them? The top four would have to bribe them with more than just, break even.