Realignment Megathread (All The Moves)
- Thread starter ISUcyclones11
- Start date
from what i gather, that is if we are able to get some of the valuable P12 brands
Yes! Some of the numbers I've seen quoted for SEC, for example, assume 3 or 4 teams getting that share of a 12 team CFP pot.
So many apples to oranges to pears to bananas to rhubarb comparisons, have to be really careful.
Which is what the comparison should be.
Anyone like Mandel making this about Big 12 vs PAC without a follow-up as to estimated the PAC10 vs Big 16 or Big 18 payout delta is either a PAC fanboy or a ******* idiot. In Mandel's case, both.
The PAC schools don't have an offer for the Big 12- it would be Big 16 or Big 18 etc. The Big 12's advantage over PAC10 is only useful as a starting point to how much better the Big 18 would be.
Here is a good article on how a Conference receives revenue and distributes it to the schools. It also compares current with OuT and potential with the BYU and 3 AAC, also note the article is dated Sept 2021.
https://sicem365.com/s/10447/the-new-big-12s-revenue-potential-six-additions-instead-of-four
Here are the Highlights:
The chart below reflects the 2020-2021 athletic year payouts for all revenue streams to programs within the Big 12.
The chart below reflects an estimated potential earnings from all revenue streams within an athletic year which includes BYU, Cincinnati, UCF and Houston to programs within the Big 12.
* Following Big 12 10% reduction
** Sugar Bowl 40mm payout minus team expenses
https://sicem365.com/s/10447/the-new-big-12s-revenue-potential-six-additions-instead-of-four
Here are the Highlights:
The chart below reflects the 2020-2021 athletic year payouts for all revenue streams to programs within the Big 12.
- Third tier revenue averages for the league exclude Texas and Oklahoma.
- After conference fees, the Big 12 Championship game and the Sugar Bowl payouts are divided equally amongst the members of the league.
- The chart excludes payouts from the College Football Playoff as well bowl game payouts outside of the Sugar Bowl. In 2020-2021, the CFP distributed $78.3 million to the Big 12.
| Big 12 w/ Texas & Oklahoma | 20-21 |
| Tier 1-2 | $26.0* |
| Tier 3 (ESPN+) | $4.0 |
| Tier 3 (Sponsorships, radio, etc.) | $11.0 |
| Big 12 Championship ($20mm) | $2.0 |
| Sugar Bowl ($30mm) | $3.0** |
| NCAA Championship (17-21) | $1.2 |
| TOTAL | $47.2 |
- After conference fees, the Big 12 Championship game and the Sugar Bowl payouts are divided equally amongst the members of the league.
- Lump sum payouts to the league for the Big 12 Championship game and Sugar Bowl are divided by 12 members rather than 10.
- The chart excludes potential payouts from the College Football Playoff as well bowl game payouts outside of the Sugar Bowl. In 2020-2021, the CFP distributed $78.3 million to the Big 12.
| Big 12 w/ BYU, UC, UCF & UH | |
| Tier 1-2 | $22.0* |
| Tier 3 (ESPN+) | $4.0 |
| Tier 3 (Sponsorships, radio, etc.) | $11.0 |
| Big 12 Championship ($20mm) | $1.67 |
| Sugar Bowl ($30mm) | $2.5** |
| NCAA Championship (17-21) | $1.2 |
| TOTAL | $42.4 |
** Sugar Bowl 40mm payout minus team expenses
How about a little apple rhubarb? Worked Ragbrai last week and raspberry rhubarb was the big hit.
I forgot to finish my thought, I had an early morning at work, lol..
Jason Scheer reported the ESPN offer we all have heard rumored 24.5m per, was for Tier 1 rights, I don't know if he meant Tier 1-2 rights. That's not too far off of what was listed for the Big12 in the article above.
The below pod is where Jason said the offer is was for Tier 1. His interview is in the first 20-30 mins of the pod.
Holy Grail BCJ Podcast Ep 340 Jason Scheer And Camp Opens
Chad Brendel and realignment expert Dave Simone are joined by 247 Arizona publisher Jason Scheer of WildcatAuthority.com to discuss where the Pac 12 stands in the national247sports.com
The tier 3 sponsorships are not from the league, they are generated and kept by the school. So they need to be substrated.
True, but CFP and Bowl $ (besides Sugar) are not included in their chart. Add those up and divide by 10 it's about a wash with the tier 3 they have listed.
First, that 10% reduction assumption is a heroic assumption; it's a long ways from the 50% that was sometimes thrown out there.
Those numbers for the Sugar and CCG tell you a lot about what games are worth based on viewership. Sugar Bowl had 9.8M viewers and CCG had 8.0M viewers.
The Big12 (with OuT) was $240M for 45 games. That tells me they are paying a LOT for a few conference games, and NOTHING for a bunch of them. Probably $10-15M for ~10 games, and then$2-3M for the rest.
The availability of marquee matchups (e.g. 2 ranked teams, or big brands) is CRITICAL, so you have something good to put into your prime windows on your prime channel. Having a bigger conference, gives you another ranked team or 2, increasing the odds. Doubly true for the Big12 since no mega brands anymore.
I think the Big12 10% reduction are the fees paid to the league (dues or membership).
Think he meant that without OuT it is estimated we are 10% reduced in value.
Could be and I would agree with his following comment but I thought Cascade was misinterpreting the asterisk in the chart labeled (* Following Big 12 10% reduction).
You are correct, I did misinterpret that *.
But my point remains. $26M down to $22M still implies 15% reduction in the contract money post-OuT. I HOPE that is right, that would be survivable, and a lot less than the mentioned 50%.
Did we just sort out a nuanced point of information on the internet? Is that allowed?
Is their Tier 3 all on their Pac network? Which is losing money? I dont believe they are getting anything from their Tier 3 since starting that network, and have actually lost money, on it.
My guess is when talking about Tier 1, he was talking 1&2, it would be rare that it was not both.
Does anyone know what Cyclone.TV was making before the Big12 switched over to ESPN+? 4m does not seem like a lot...
I know it was talked about on here. I remember the discussions. For some reason 2.3M sticks in my head but I don't know if that is right.
What is the chance ND is helping ACC use FOX/BIG to shakedown ESPN?
ACC with a motivated ESPN that is willing to do things to keep the ACC alive (similar to LHN with Big 12 in 2010) is a risk to Big 12 imo.
In reading the ACC forums, many are wanting to add PAC schools and 1-2 Big 12 schools, often Houston, Cincinnati, and KU. Some Baylor talk. Whether this is indicative of leadership, who knows, but that conference is desperate to expand. Who is to say ESPN doesn't agree to redo that deal with unequal revenue sharing (mentioned by ESPN's Pete Thamel) in attempt to appease schools and lure additions?
If we can't get the Big 16/18/20 to occur, do Big 12 schools consider leveraging the ACC GOR length and current PAC uncertainty against each other, to get a ACC-Big 12 pseudo merger? What is the downside of all but BYU and UCF joining the current ACC? If it stays together, it is superior to adding 4 corners to Big 12 imo. Worst case scenario it loses 8 ACC schools, and BYU and UCF are added, and it is a Big 18, waiting on the top 6 PAC schools like we are now.
ACC with a motivated ESPN that is willing to do things to keep the ACC alive (similar to LHN with Big 12 in 2010) is a risk to Big 12 imo.
In reading the ACC forums, many are wanting to add PAC schools and 1-2 Big 12 schools, often Houston, Cincinnati, and KU. Some Baylor talk. Whether this is indicative of leadership, who knows, but that conference is desperate to expand. Who is to say ESPN doesn't agree to redo that deal with unequal revenue sharing (mentioned by ESPN's Pete Thamel) in attempt to appease schools and lure additions?
If we can't get the Big 16/18/20 to occur, do Big 12 schools consider leveraging the ACC GOR length and current PAC uncertainty against each other, to get a ACC-Big 12 pseudo merger? What is the downside of all but BYU and UCF joining the current ACC? If it stays together, it is superior to adding 4 corners to Big 12 imo. Worst case scenario it loses 8 ACC schools, and BYU and UCF are added, and it is a Big 18, waiting on the top 6 PAC schools like we are now.
The fact that UCLA averaged like in the low 40,000's for home attendance at the Rose Bowl tells you all you need to know about the PAC attendance.
As long as the stadiums being discussed have decent capacity, I think % of capacity is still useful.