Line play... (long)

[Al_4_State]

Is the biggest thing holding this team back. On both sides of the ball.

Sure, it's easy to sit back and blame our QB for 0 points, or blame our DBs for Landry Jones hitting 30/34, but it ALL starts up front on both sides of the ball.

1) Our running game is non-existant right now. Last year, we ran the ball extremely well in our wins. Our line was shoving people around, and creating holes. We could milk the clock and just chew up yardage. This year, there's no consistency in our run game. You HAVE to get the run game going for the offense to work. I know people thought we'd be running a Mike Leach style Air-Raid, but unless you have a lazer QB or open receivers (we have neither), you need to run the damn ball. We did last year, and we aren't doing it right now. Yes, the lack of a run game is on the line. We have very capable running backs, but they need holes.

2) In the passing game, Arnaud, while not being a great player, gets little to no help. OU had him on the run all last night. There were way too many plays where he had to scramble to get the ball off. That didn't happen nearly as much last year. People want to complain about our QB, but look around college football. If you can't run the ball and give your QB time, they have to be an exceptionally good player to be successful. Right now, we'd be just as bad with almost anyone taking snaps, outside of a top 5-10 QB. If you can't run the ball, and you can't give the QB time, your offense is going to suck. Period.

Moving to defense...

1) Again, I see a lot of people blaming our defensive backs. Line play is just as critical on defense as offense. We are getting no pressure whatsoever. Opposing QBs sit in the pocket for what seems like hours. You can't expect your defensive backfield to cover someone for as long our guys have to be in coverage. Receivers have time to get open, and QBs have time to find them. Our best defenses in the past have ALWAYS included outstanding pass rushes. We don't have a pass rush to speak of.

2) Same goes in the run game. Our line gets blown off the ball, and it forces our linebackers to make tackles 4 to 5 yards downfield on every freaking play. Again, this is NOT a recipe for success. You have to get a push to contain the run game, and we have proven utterly incapable of this. If you can't stop the run, you can't stop the pass.

Basically, people want to complain about this guy or that guy, but in the end the fate of this, and any team comes down to line play. Iowa knows this, and it's the key to Ferentz's success. You could swap any of Iowa's skill position players or defensive backfield guys with us, and we wouldn't be any better off due to our poor line play. We could have Cromartie and Revis in our defensive backfield, and it still wouldn't matter when opposing QBs have all day. We could have John Elway circa 1988 playing QB, and we'd still have a limp offense without a consistent run game. Thankfully, on the offensive side of things, we have what looks to be an excellent crop of recruits coming up the ladder. Defensively however, we're still in the wilderness. Until the line play on both sides of the ball improves, our offense will struggle to do anything, and our defense will leak like a sieve.

 

[sogocat]

Great post, both lines are the most important parts of a football team and until that improves at ISU they are going nowhere. Need to hire special recruiter to concentrate on this area.

 

[RossHallHero]

Need to hire special recruiter to concentrate on this area.

Yes, we should hire a Lineman Czar to address the problem!!!! That works in Washington, like a charm!!!!

I'm sure the coaches that we have are aware of the need and are addressing it with the type of urgency it deserves.

 

[CylentButDeadly]

Completely agree. It all starts up front and we just don't have the horses right now to make the difference.

 

[ISUFan22]

No, it's the quarterback and only the quarterback, dummy!

 

[4C3133787]

Last night was pathetic. Just think, now we have to play those fools every year.

 

[Rogue52]

The line play is exceptionally horrible. If we ever want to have any kind of sustained success, we need to develop a program like Iowa.

Balanced offense and defense with EXCEPTIONAL play on the line.

 

[besserheimerphat]

We just do not have the talent across the board to be competitive with the Top 10 ranked teams we've lost to. Against teams we're more talented than (NIU and UNI) we're 2-0. Against teams we're not too far behind the talent gap (KSU and TTech) we're 1-1 with both games being competitive. Against teams we're significantly less talented than at nearly every position (#15 Iowa, #10 Utah, #6 OU), we've gotten destroyed.

How many games are left on the schedule where we have a similarly talented opponent? KU, CO, um....

 

[isuno1fan]

Line play....(short)

is not good.

 

[epstud74]

Line play....(short)

is not good.

A friend of mine coached the starting Utah center in HS

After the game the player mentioned how surprised he was at how weak the ISU DL was. He did not think there was a legit Big12 player on the DL. LBs were okay, but the DL was not very good.

 

[CYVADER]

so is it players or lack of player development? some of these guys have been on the team long enough that i would think they have to be near peak improvement.

 

[heitclone]

good post and I think you're spot on. The fact is every unit on offense and defense is struggling and we don't have the talent for one group to cover the lack of talent at other groups. Like you said we have very capable and proven skill position guys but our entire offensive scheme (especially the run game) is built around AA making reads based on oline play and the offense getting in a rhythm. When that rhythm gets bump AA goes from a solid QB to a poor QB, and when AA is out of his rhythm the back struggle to hit the holes and WR are forced to make tough catches. It all just compounds. The same goes on defense, when the Dline isn't holding its own LB's have bodies blocking them and DB's are forced to either play in coverage far too long or make way more tackles than they need to.

I think we have a lot of talent at the skill spots on both offense and defense but we don't have so much talent that we can hide our weaknesses. Unfortunately we just played 2 teams who were tailor made to exploit those weaknesses.

 

[Cyhart]

Is the biggest thing holding this team back. On both sides of the ball.

Sure, it's easy to sit back and blame our QB for 0 points, or blame our DBs for Landry Jones hitting 30/34, but it ALL starts up front on both sides of the ball.

1) Our running game is non-existant right now. Last year, we ran the ball extremely well in our wins. Our line was shoving people around, and creating holes. We could milk the clock and just chew up yardage. This year, there's no consistency in our run game. You HAVE to get the run game going for the offense to work. I know people thought we'd be running a Mike Leach style Air-Raid, but unless you have a lazer QB or open receivers (we have neither), you need to run the damn ball. We did last year, and we aren't doing it right now. Yes, the lack of a run game is on the line. We have very capable running backs, but they need holes.

2) In the passing game, Arnaud, while not being a great player, gets little to no help. OU had him on the run all last night. There were way too many plays where he had to scramble to get the ball off. That didn't happen nearly as much last year. People want to complain about our QB, but look around college football. If you can't run the ball and give your QB time, they have to be an exceptionally good player to be successful. Right now, we'd be just as bad with almost anyone taking snaps, outside of a top 5-10 QB. If you can't run the ball, and you can't give the QB time, your offense is going to suck. Period.

Moving to defense...

1) Again, I see a lot of people blaming our defensive backs. Line play is just as critical on defense as offense. We are getting no pressure whatsoever. Opposing QBs sit in the pocket for what seems like hours. You can't expect your defensive backfield to cover someone for as long our guys have to be in coverage. Receivers have time to get open, and QBs have time to find them. Our best defenses in the past have ALWAYS included outstanding pass rushes. We don't have a pass rush to speak of.

2) Same goes in the run game. Our line gets blown off the ball, and it forces our linebackers to make tackles 4 to 5 yards downfield on every freaking play. Again, this is NOT a recipe for success. You have to get a push to contain the run game, and we have proven utterly incapable of this. If you can't stop the run, you can't stop the pass.

Basically, people want to complain about this guy or that guy, but in the end the fate of this, and any team comes down to line play. Iowa knows this, and it's the key to Ferentz's success. You could swap any of Iowa's skill position players or defensive backfield guys with us, and we wouldn't be any better off due to our poor line play. We could have Cromartie and Revis in our defensive backfield, and it still wouldn't matter when opposing QBs have all day. We could have John Elway circa 1988 playing QB, and we'd still have a limp offense without a consistent run game. Thankfully, on the offensive side of things, we have what looks to be an excellent crop of recruits coming up the ladder. Defensively however, we're still in the wilderness. Until the line play on both sides of the ball improves, our offense will struggle to do anything, and our defense will leak like a sieve.

D-line: It seemed like a lot of the time Landry was taking 3-step-drops and hitting receivers. The d-line wouldn't have had the time to be a factor even if they were good.

O-line: Even though there wasnt a lot of reaction (unlike the Sims news), I was really worried when it was announced that we were losing Haughton. Looks like that worry was valid.

 

[pulse]

Is the biggest thing holding this team back. On both sides of the ball.

Completely agree. The line on both sides of the ball is horrendous. I'm not going to go off, because a simple description of "its terrible" sums it up nicely. I knew OU was going to destroy us, when Stoops has 2 weeks to prepare for us I knew it was going to be ugly. I still believe we can have a decent season, we won't be completely outclassed in our last 4 games like we were against Utah and OU. Getting beat down by Top 10 teams doesn't faze me, but I won't be happy if we can't win after our mid-season gauntlet.

 

[heitclone]

D-line: It seemed like a lot of the time Landry was taking 3-step-drops and hitting receivers. The d-line wouldn't have had the time to be a factor even if they were good.

O-line: Even though there wasnt a lot of reaction (unlike the Sims news), I was really worried when it was announced that we were losing Haughton. Looks like that worry was valid.[/QUOTE]

Thats a great point, and I think most people assumed our line would be good enough to absorb his loss based on how it played last year. I think thats another factor as well, we saw a lot of guys be productive last year when we played a much softer schedule than this year. We had guys who weren't quite big 12 starting caliber playing last year but we had the advantage of playing some teams who were in a similar or worse situation that us. Trade out Utah for Army and OU for Baylor and some of these guys wouldn't have been exposed, and we'd still have the same opinion of them as in the preseason.I honestly don't think we're any worse off than last year talent-wise and we found our way to a bowl game despite a couple games looking like we didn't belong on the field with a decent BCS conference team (Iowa,A&M,Okie St). I'm optimistic we still can get those last 3 wins. We just need to split our last 2 road games and go 2-1 at home, not an easy task but the road gets a tad easier after next week.

 

[checker21]

What I really noticed watching this game is that are talent level through out the team is very good, good, and bad. There is not much in between. For example, our secondary has three good and very good players - Johnson, Sims, and Benton, but the 4th is very bad. If you notice our bad players always get exposed we can't hide them. Our O-line is the same way. I think if we could just sprinkle in some average players we would be a much better team.

 

[Rural]

I'd like to reference the early season meeting of North Carolina and LSU to highlight what the guys on our coaching staff are up against.

Remember that NC had 13 guys sitting out/suspended? That included 7 defensive starters and I believe 3 other guys who played some.

I watched that game and what immediately struck me was how NC had great athletes all over the field even minus 13 guys, most of whom were starters. The game came down to a goal-line play away from beating what is now a top ten team in LSU. This is without 10 guys who play a lot. Can you imagine ISU in the same situation? We'd have to forfeit.

Don't just say it's the lines, we need massive talent infusions EVERYWHERE. That's the task for CPR.

 

[crash_zone]

What does it look like for next year? Don't we have several red-shirt guys on both lines? That indicates to me that the coaches (1) knew it was a problem (2) are trying to address it by building a system that constantly has developed players to start as juniors and seniors (3) being in year #2, we just haven't had a chance to see this yet.

Please, someone tell me this is the case. Please?

 

[heitclone]

I'd like to reference the early season meeting of North Carolina and LSU to highlight what the guys on our coaching staff are up against.

Remember that NC had 13 guys sitting out/suspended? That included 7 defensive starters and I believe 3 other guys who played some.

I watched that game and what immediately struck me was how NC had great athletes all over the field even minus 13 guys, most of whom were starters. The game came down to a goal-line play away from beating what is now a top ten team in LSU. This is without 10 guys who play a lot. Can you imagine ISU in the same situation? We'd have to forfeit.

Don't just say it's the lines, we need massive talent infusions EVERYWHERE. That's the task for CPR.

You're right, this is the hardest part about a coaching change. Let alone 2 coaching changes in 5 years, finding guys who can fit your system and come in and play are the priority of a new coach and building depth can take 3 or 4 recruiting classes.

 

[gregniowa]

Until the line play on both sides of the ball improves, our offense will struggle to do anything, and our defense will leak like a sieve.

Our lines have not looked like decent Div 1 lines should look - and it's not all coaching. While we will not likely land top tier recruits, there is much better out there to be had, even at the JuCo level. They are simply outmatched against upper tier players.

Even top tier Div 1 quarterbacks would have great difficulty performing well under the pressure our OL has allowed. That our QB's are not top tier national recruits has been obvious from the day they were recruited until now. In games like the last couple, we have seen them perform poorly under huge points deficit pressure, all while sitting behind a offensive line that provides only a couple of seconds delay to top tier defensive players getting to them. Its more than a "leaky sieve" line analogy, the line is providing little more than what a big rock in a river provides, a slight delay that the water simply goes around.

Both the line recruiting and strength training programs should be seriously focused upon. Reality would dictate that it is unlikely that we will be able to attract the type of offensive talent anytime soon that would be required to outscore the better Big 12 teams on the basis of the caliber of our offensive skill positions alone. We will need to provide time for plays to develop for our offensive skill players against likely (naturally) better athletes and we need a defense that will keep the score low enough to give us a chance of winning on a well-coached strategy basis.

Unfortunately, right now, we have neither the defense or OL to do that consistantly. But we are at a level that we can do well against somewhat lesser teams, assuming we show up with our best on display.

As a side note, in case any members of the team looks at these boards. I want them all to know I, along with many in the fan-base respect them immensely for what they are doing and realize how difficult it is for them to succeed against the teams on this year's schedule. They are, in addition to athetes, full-time students at ISU carrying a load academically, with limited amounts of practice time, from week-to-week. Improving and adjusting to the play sets for next week's top tier ranked team would be challenging for any, but even more so for a team of the level of ISU. They are in a constant mode of seriously playing "up", against both elite teams and elite individual players that are some of the best in the nation. I am sure it is a very hard load to bear at times. Bottom line, our guys have a bigger weight on their shoulders playing up against teams that are at a higher level than the players on the other teams do playing us. But, nevertheless, the men on our team, the Cyclones, have heart, and are continuing to work hard to improve their individual and team skills - and for that, I thank them as a fan. And while sometimes, encountering elite teams like Utah and Oklahoma may cause everything to kind of fall apart on the field, plainly exhibiting that our team still has a lot of areas to improve in, that does not mean we are not improving. Nor does it mean these young men, who we cheer on on Saturdays, are not giving their all.

Believe it or not, many of us can relate to being up against things that seem bigger than we are likely to overcome. In this economy, many of us are challenged financially, some out of work, with mouths to feed. Others have physical challenges, sickness or conditions that we or others in our families are struggling with. Others are struggling with personal issues with those that we love and care about. Life is often filled with challenges that try the hearts of men (and women). So, while seeing our Cyclones, our team, get beat so badly (like with Oklahoma) is saddening, we know how hard it is for these young men to emerge victorious against that caliber of opponent. But seeing these young men show up each week having, on top of their academic load, worked diligently to strengthen and improve themselves so that they can take on the next giant with sling and stones in hand, is personally encouraging.

They show up to try and do what no one thinks they can do, they try and figure out how to win against seemingly unbeatable opponents. Some times they fail in terms of points on the board, even having expended their best efforts, but sometimes they succeed - even gloriously, like with TT. But regardless of their level of victory the previous week, they will work hard to improve and show up the following week to do battle again - to pit their talents, skill, heart and energy against a new set of opponents. And THAT takes heart and cojones, it takes courage - something we can all admire, respect and cheer on. We all want to see them, underdog status and all, do well against the odds - and if some wins can be obtained when the naysayers cry "impossible!" - all the better.

So when we fans talk about our hope that recruiting goes well, its not that we disrespect our present Cyclone players, its just that we want reinforcements to arrive soon, to help them achieve better success in the future. For we know their task is very hard - going up against some of the best in the nation - and they need all the help they can get.

But until recruiting reinforcements arrive and get trained and deployed, I know our Cyclones will dig deeper, work harder and apply their intelligence to try and use what they have to its greatest advantage. And I, as a fan, can ask no more than that.

This week, I hope the wearers of cardinal and gold can go back to the supply closet and open up a fresh can of whoop-* this week so we can succeed at giving Texas a barrel full of problems next weekend. I imagine they think they are going to have it easy - let's surprise them!