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twocoach said:
I am not saying that Kansas felt the game was meaningless; they certainly wanted to win. It's just the tourney that is meaningless. As for the game tonight, does that somehow carry over into next year's battle for the conference title that matters? Nope.
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Why are you valuing the regular season title over the tourney title? I understand you have to be better for longer but now is the time that matters. This is the time to win and ISU is doing that. The tourney title actually has a tangible benefit - it's an auto-bid.

I agree that the regular season title is much less about getting hot at the right time and being a more talented team but now that's all over. We are dancing, you are dancing. We have an extra game in prime time on ESPN. At ISU, THAT MATTERS. We need it.
 
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twocoach said:
You won the Big 12? Eh, wasn't that the semi-final of the conference TOURNEY?

KU's defensive problems are because their guards suck at defending. The most horrible offender is their JUNIOR PG and their two best defenders are their two most likely OAD freshmen. Nice try, though.
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twocoach said:
So you really think that the fact he is from there and played there will keep him there? You really think that the only job he'd take would be some random nba job for a crappy franchise but he wouldn't go to Kansas because of the "rivalry"? You guys are delusional. There are only a handful of nba coaches getting paid more than Bill Self. Home is nice and all but...
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twocoach said:
Insecure? Of what? ISU finally beating Kansas in the meaningless conference tourney? ISU had two first team all conference players and STILL couldn't win the conference over a team that replaced it's entire lineup, has the worst defensive stats and turnover stats of any team in the Bill Self and who had their best defensive player miss three conference game. There probably will not be another season like this any time soon where Kansas was more ripe for the taking and they won the conference by two games. Sorry, but if KU can win the conference this year then no one is catching them any time soon.
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You can't fix stupid.
 
twocoach said:
I am not saying that Kansas felt the game was meaningless; they certainly wanted to win. It's just the tourney that is meaningless. As for the game tonight, does that somehow carry over into next year's battle for the conference title that matters? Nope.
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Not necessarily meaningless when losing like KU did may have costed them any shot at a 1 seed. If KU would have won the Big 12 tourney, I really think they would have been a 1 seed. Especially, with Nova losing.
 
BoxsterCy said:
No, Twocoach is worse than stupid. He is an idealogist and no amount of discussion or exchange of ideas or opinions will move him from the position his ideology directs. He is going to always be right and he doesn't even have to use his brain at all to know that with certainty. I suspect all of aspects of his life, social, political etc are dogmatic.
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Honestly, would we be any different when talking with Beaker fans? Other than the fact that zoophilia is much more common in the KU fanbase than it is within the ISU fanbase?
 
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UraMallas said:
Why are you valuing the regular season title over the tourney title? I understand you have to be better for longer but now is the time that matters. This is the time to win and ISU is doing that. The tourney title actually has a tangible benefit - it's an auto-bid.

I agree that the regular season title is much less about getting hot at the right time and being a more talented team but now that's all over. We are dancing, you are dancing. We have an extra game in prime time on ESPN. At ISU, THAT MATTERS. We need it.
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Regular season Big 12 title > Big 12 Tourney title.

But don't pretend a conference tourney championship, particularly this one this year, doesn't matter. The Big 12 is a league of nasty teams. If you can best them all over a weekend like this, that's significant to your prospects in the NCAAs.
 
Die4Cy said:
Regular season Big 12 title > Big 12 Tourney title.

But don't pretend a conference tourney championship, particularly this one this year, doesn't matter. The Big 12 is a league of nasty teams. If you can best them all over a weekend like this, that's significant to your prospects in the NCAAs.
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I know you quoted me, and maybe I wasn't clear, but I agree completely.
 
Have a guy I work with who is a huge KU fan, not a ****** by any means. Before the tournament he was saying that the 2 teams he didn't want to face before the championship game were ISU and Kstate. When I found out the big man was out I knew we had a really good cahnce with out him dominating the boards on the inside and just killing us all game. Really hope we can keep this up and drop the ahmmer on Baylor.
 
Two coach has been annoying over the last few weeks, but the guy did give a complimentary thread post isu so he wasn't ducking the site like many posters tried to insinuate.
Now that is settled.
Fred would never go to KU just as he would never take a random NBA job. I think the Timberwolves would be a consideration for obvious reasons but other than that, it would have to be the right job as reliable sources have said he has turned down a couple NBA offers already. Fred is a special guy who not only means a lot to IsU, but ISU means a lot to him. KU might possibly be the last place he would coach if offered tbh.
 
twocoach said:
If you don't think that Hoiberg would take the Kansas job if offered then you have lost your mind. Like I said, Manning be be the next coach at Kansas but Hoiberg would take it if offered. Everyone would. There's a reason why we have only had to offer the job to one coach when the position has come open. I cannot remember a single coach ever saying no thanks to the offer.
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Is Kansas' arena better then Hilton? NO. Is kansas a better university than Iowa State? NO. Are blue and red better colors than Gold and red? NO. Is Kansas' money better then Iowa States Money? Think Not! Would the KANSAS fans ever LOVE Fred more than Iowa State? Hell No! He wouldn't be the "Mayor" in Larryville like he is in Ames. Truth is, Kansas would be a STEP DOWN to where he is now. KU is not the end all for Coaching. Fred's grass is greener right in his own back yard. IB
 
iowaboy said:
Is Kansas' arena better then Hilton? NO. Is kansas a better university than Iowa State? NO. Are blue and red better colors than Gold and red? NO. Is Kansas' money better then Iowa States Money? Think Not! Would the KANSAS fans ever LOVE Fred more than Iowa State? Hell No! He wouldn't be the "Mayor" in Larryville like he is in Ames. Truth is, Kansas would be a STEP DOWN to where he is now. KU is not the end all for Coaching. Fred's grass is greener right in his own back yard. IB
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I would love to go see a game at Hilton some day but I have yet to see it on any lists of best places to see a college basketball game. However I have never seen such a list NOT contain Allen Fieldhouse so I will respectfully disagree with you there.

Is Kansas' money better than Iowa State's money? No, but there sure is a lot more of it. Self makes about three times what Hoiberg makes. But like I said, I do not expect to see the chair at Kansas open up any time in the next 10+ years and I hope that Manning will take the job once it does. His turnaround at Tulsa in his very first year after losing a ton of players is remarkable. He's doing a great job and will be an excellent coach. A little on the shy side but that will improve as he gains head coaching experience.
 
CoKane said:
Not helping yourself with this post. We lost 5 guys too. It's not like we brought everyone back and still couldn't do crap. And this isn't college football, every game in college basketball means something. Kansas was playing for a 1 seed. I don't want to hear that they didn't want a 1 seed, because that is complete BS. Everybody wants a 1 seed and anyone who says they don't deserves the label of a dumb ***.
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Niang and Ejim were third and fourth in scoring on the team last year and combined for 23 points per game. Ellis (5.8 points) and Tharpe (5.5 points) were our leading scorers returning. Sorry, sell that BS somewhere else.

And AGAIN, I did not say anything about KU not wanting to win. Just don't tout winning the tourney as being "conference champs" like lame Mizzou did back in 2012. It's pathetic. It's a weekend tourney to generate revenue.
 
UraMallas said:
Fred brings in senior transfer, gets multiple BIG XII awards and was a Wooden Award finalist. Self brings in senior transfer, he gets crammed in a dress and danced around all semi-night by Niang.

Remember when talking about our all-conference duo that they didn't start that way. They didn't have offers from half the country coming out of high school. They didn't pass the "eye test". Niang as a third-team talent in his sophomore year is another example. So, remember, when speaking about all the amazing talent ISU has that it wasn't pulled directly off the one-and-done talent tree like KU has the luxury of doing. They were pruned to be pretty.
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What does that have to do with anything? Talent is talent, no matter how long it took to develop. The fact is that Hoiberg had two first team all conference players and a third team all conference player and still was two Naz Long prayers away from being .500 in the conference, ending up 4th in the conference. And don't give me the BS about developing the talent from nothing. Kevin Young was a starter for KU last year and was shagging balls for a women's JUCO team a few years before that. Connor Teahan was the first guard off the bench for a KU team that played for the national title and was a WALK ON for three years prior to that season. Self has a better track record of developing talent into great college players than almost any other coach in the country.

We had a little OAD blip with Selby and Henry (neither of whom was actually OAD talent but left after one year thanks to some pretty terrible outside advice) but this is the first year that Self has landed elite OAD level players in Wiggins and Embiid (who wasn't even considered a OAD talent when the season started). Self has been the king of developing players in the 30-75 class rankings.
 
BoxsterCy said:
No, Twocoach is worse than stupid. He is an idealogist and no amount of discussion or exchange of ideas or opinions will move him from the position his ideology directs. He is going to always be right and he doesn't even have to use his brain at all to know that with certainty. I suspect all of aspects of his life, social, political etc are dogmatic.
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You spent too much time in a classroom and not enough time outside. Unless we are talking about verifiable facts like scores and records, the conversations wee are having are simply a matter of opinion. Opinions cannot be verified, so they cannot be labeled as right or wrong. Logical, illogical, rational, irrational, smart or stupid can be applied, but by no means do I think that I am RIGHT. I just have my opinion which is that I think that IF Hoiberg was offered the job at Kansas I think he would take it. No biggie. You disagree. That's fine.

Butler folks thought the same about Brad Stevens; a local guy from Indy with family there and a long history with the program. "He won't leave, he loves it here." See ya! Now he's on his way to getting fired from the Celtics. I give him two more years sucking for Boston and then he'll be snagging the first elite coaching job that pops open.
 
twocoach said:
You spent too much time in a classroom and not enough time outside. Unless we are talking about verifiable facts like scores and records, the conversations wee are having are simply a matter of opinion. Opinions cannot be verified, so they cannot be labeled as right or wrong. Logical, illogical, rational, irrational, smart or stupid can be applied, but by no means do I think that I am RIGHT. I just have my opinion which is that I think that IF Hoiberg was offered the job at Kansas I think he would take it. No biggie. You disagree. That's fine.

Butler folks thought the same about Brad Stevens; a local guy from Indy with family there and a long history with the program. "He won't leave, he loves it here." See ya! Now he's on his way to getting fired from the Celtics. I give him two more years sucking for Boston and then he'll be snagging the first elite coaching job that pops open.
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The Boston Celtics is a waaay better job than Kansas. My goodness you're arrogant.
 
Guys, if you hadn't heard, we just won the Big 12 tournament. Let this thread cool down for a while. :)
 
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