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***Official 2023 Chicago Cubs Thread***

Cyforce said:
This really feels like a plant from Boras. More of a last ditch effort to drum up competition. I've felt for awhile we'd get him for around 7yr 175 mil. The longer this goes we have a better shot at a 5 or 6 year term.

www.bleachernation.com

Obsessive Cody Bellinger Watch: A Final Leverage Push? Will Anyone Move?

Cody Bellinger is the best free agent bat still out there. What are the latest rumors?
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At this point if no one is offering long term deal for him I hope they get him on another prove it type deal or nothing longer than 3-5 years with some kind of option(s) in it. He fills an immediate need now but with all the OF prospect depth a long term deal is not really necessary. I still have concerns about his production going forward. I'm not sold yet that last season is what we'll see consistently and I have a feeling a lot of other teams feel the same else he would have been signed by now. Another prove it deal would not be the worst thing for him as another year similar to last season should give teams enough of a sample size that he's worth the long term dollars he's seeking.
 
RoseClone said:
Not really news and I assume most have seen this but didn't see where it was posted. Who knows what's actually going to happen??

SI: Cubs reportedly have no interest meeting Bellingers current asking price.

https://www.si.com/mlb/cubs/news/ch...meeting-bellingers-current-asking-price-brad9
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If they don't want to budge then go find another bat on a 1 year deal and eventually Boras will have to cave if no teams are willing to meet those demands. No one else seems to be interested in that price tag either. I've said it before, I view him more as a short term luxury and not a long term need given the glut of OF in the farm system and I haven't given up on Mervis of McGeary possibly being a solution at 1B either. They already traded for Busch too who looks like who they want to play 1B too so between him and PCA it would be playing musical chairs down the road trying to find AB for everyone without trading someone. Happ and Suzuki both have full no trade clauses which complicates that too.

I would be fine with the Cubs standing pat and telling Boras they'll pay him a hefty 1 year salary to come back or some kind of 2 or 3 year deal with a nice AAV and options to go with it but at that price there is no reason to commit 5-7 years to him. Boras is losing leverage by the day the longer he holds out and teams are going to start signing some of these other guys still out there to fill out rosters and his guys will eventually have to come to terms that a big long term deal is not going to happen. Boras has pinched every penny he can from teams over the years so would be nice to see them finally stick it to him for once.
 
CYdTracked said:
If they don't want to budge then go find another bat on a 1 year deal and eventually Boras will have to cave if no teams are willing to meet those demands. No one else seems to be interested in that price tag either. I've said it before, I view him more as a short term luxury and not a long term need given the glut of OF in the farm system and I haven't given up on Mervis of McGeary possibly being a solution at 1B either. They already traded for Busch too who looks like who they want to play 1B too so between him and PCA it would be playing musical chairs down the road trying to find AB for everyone without trading someone. Happ and Suzuki both have full no trade clauses which complicates that too.

I would be fine with the Cubs standing pat and telling Boras they'll pay him a hefty 1 year salary to come back or some kind of 2 or 3 year deal with a nice AAV and options to go with it but at that price there is no reason to commit 5-7 years to him. Boras is losing leverage by the day the longer he holds out and teams are going to start signing some of these other guys still out there to fill out rosters and his guys will eventually have to come to terms that a big long term deal is not going to happen. Boras has pinched every penny he can from teams over the years so would be nice to see them finally stick it to him for once.
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I've stated this before, but I believe if PCA takes off Bellinger would go to right leaving Suzuki and Happ in left. Personally I'd go with Suzuki. I doubt Happ would want to stay if he's relegated to the bench.
 
I'm good with moving on from Bellinger.

Overpay for two years of Chapman (2/55) and lets get to Spring Training.

If I had the card:

Happ LF
Hoerner 2B
Suzuki RF
Morel DH
Chapman 3B
Swanson SS
Busch 1B
Gomes/Amaya C
Tauchman/Canario CF (until PCA is ready in June)
 
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Cyforce said:
I've stated this before, but I believe if PCA takes off Bellinger would go to right leaving Suzuki and Happ in left. Personally I'd go with Suzuki. I doubt Happ would want to stay if he's relegated to the bench.
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Giving Happ a no trade clause when you already have another corner OF with one was just a stupid move by the front office. I have nothing against Happ but the Cubs have missed the mark more than once to trade him when he had good trade value on a cheaper contract. They also gave him that contract fully knowing there was a bunch of OF prospect depth they could eventually replace him with. I also think if he wasn't on the roster right now they probably would have given in and resigned Bellinger to a long term deal too. Happ is an above average OF but he's not a star nor do I think he ever will be much more than he is right now which is a solid defender and probably going to bat somewhere around .250 or about with about 15-20 HR and around 70 RBI most years.

Won't know until we see them get their shot in Chicago but I think some of the OF guys are possibly going to have higher ceilings than Happ when it comes to hitting for power. I think with Bellinger it comes down to are you committed to giving your prospects a fair shot in the majors when they are ready or are you going to commit to Belli over the long haul and start making deals from your prospect surplus. There are guys both at 1B and OF that are going to be impact players or may not cut it in the majors, we just don't know and the more guys you have in the mix at a position the less runway they are going to get when they get called up probably.

I could probably stomach Chapman on a deal no more than 3 years because he's a solid 3B glove and fills a bigger position need right now even if he may be regressing some offensively. I wouldn't be against adding another starting pitcher to the rotation either as a counter move to not being able to sign a big name bat as good pitching will usually keep you in games. Right now its Steele, Hendricks, Shota, Taillon then someone out of Assad, Wicks, Smyly, and Wesneski fighting it out for that 5th spot. I don't find anything wrong with adding another proven veteran starter to the rotation given we don't know what to expect out of that 5th spot plus both Hendricks and Taillon can be a mixed bag at times and you will have the inevitable injury at some point. Would allow Assad and Smyly to work out of the bullpen as long arms where they were effective last season and can have Wicks and Wesneski stay stretched out as a starter in Iowa to start the season as injury depth.
 
CYdTracked said:
Giving Happ a no trade clause when you already have another corner OF with one was just a stupid move by the front office. I have nothing against Happ but the Cubs have missed the mark more than once to trade him when he had good trade value on a cheaper contract. They also gave him that contract fully knowing there was a bunch of OF prospect depth they could eventually replace him with. I also think if he wasn't on the roster right now they probably would have given in and resigned Bellinger to a long term deal too. Happ is an above average OF but he's not a star nor do I think he ever will be much more than he is right now which is a solid defender and probably going to bat somewhere around .250 or about with about 15-20 HR and around 70 RBI most years.

Won't know until we see them get their shot in Chicago but I think some of the OF guys are possibly going to have higher ceilings than Happ when it comes to hitting for power. I think with Bellinger it comes down to are you committed to giving your prospects a fair shot in the majors when they are ready or are you going to commit to Belli over the long haul and start making deals from your prospect surplus. There are guys both at 1B and OF that are going to be impact players or may not cut it in the majors, we just don't know and the more guys you have in the mix at a position the less runway they are going to get when they get called up probably.

I could probably stomach Chapman on a deal no more than 3 years because he's a solid 3B glove and fills a bigger position need right now even if he may be regressing some offensively. I wouldn't be against adding another starting pitcher to the rotation either as a counter move to not being able to sign a big name bat as good pitching will usually keep you in games. Right now its Steele, Hendricks, Shota, Taillon then someone out of Assad, Wicks, Smyly, and Wesneski fighting it out for that 5th spot. I don't find anything wrong with adding another proven veteran starter to the rotation given we don't know what to expect out of that 5th spot plus both Hendricks and Taillon can be a mixed bag at times and you will have the inevitable injury at some point. Would allow Assad and Smyly to work out of the bullpen as long arms where they were effective last season and can have Wicks and Wesneski stay stretched out as a starter in Iowa to start the season as injury depth.
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You do realize how valuable what you described here is right? He's been that consistently for 7 years in the majors and I'd be willing to take it to the bank that he'll be that for the last 3 years on his contract.

Since his MLB debut he's 42nd in WAR among position players, 56th in WAR last year. So he's at a minimum among the top 3rd of all MLB starting position players. There is not a lot of prospects that can/will exceed that, so you don't throw that guy away at a young age for prospect gambles.
 
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Cyforce said:
I've stated this before, but I believe if PCA takes off Bellinger would go to right leaving Suzuki and Happ in left. Personally I'd go with Suzuki. I doubt Happ would want to stay if he's relegated to the bench.
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At some point is Happ going to move to 1B or split time between LF & 1B? His arm is still great, but he seemed to make more fielding mistakes in the 2nd half of the 2023 season. Not unusual for a 30 year old to lose some speed.
 
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1UNI2ISU said:
I'm good with moving on from Bellinger.

Overpay for two years of Chapman (2/55) and lets get to Spring Training.

If I had the card:

Happ LF
Hoerner 2B
Suzuki RF
Morel DH
Chapman 3B
Swanson SS
Busch 1B
Gomes/Amaya C
Tauchman/Canario CF (until PCA is ready in June)
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That starting lineup would scare me. On a solid team, I don't think Happ, Suzuki or Morel would bat above the 5th spot. And that assumes Suzuki can come close to replicating his .288 BA in 2023.

Tauchman had a nice year in 2023, but if PCA or Canario aren't ready to be an everyday CF I feel like the Cubs need to sign a FA CF. Sign a guy like Profar or Taylor- they are OK hitters and decent fielders.

Although the Cubs have a lot of OF prospects in the pipeline- not sure any can be counted on for starting 140 games in 2024. Also in this era, nothing wrong with 4 OF's because they can rotate in the field and play DH on their "off" days.

Also it's easy to forget how much grief both Happ and Suzuki were getting before the All-Star break last season. Happ had 11 of his 21 HR's in Aug/Sep. Suzuki hit 12 of his 20 HR's in Aug/Sep and his average rose from .255 to .285 after the All Star break. Hopefully, both guys can replicate their last 2 months- but if not there should be at-bats for guys in the pipeline.
 
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isucy86 said:
That starting lineup would scare me. On a solid team, I don't think Happ, Suzuki or Morel would bat above the 5th spot. And that assume Suzuki can come close to replicating his .288 BA in 2023.

Tauchman had a nice year in 2023, but if PCA or Canario aren't ready to be an everyday CF I feel like the Cubs need to sign a FA CF. Sign a guy like Profar or Taylor- they are OK hitters and decent fielders.

Although the Cubs have a lot of OF prospects in the pipeline- not sure any can be counted on for starting 140 games in 2024. Also in this era, nothing wrong with 4 OF's because they can rotate in the field and play DH on their "off" days.

Also it's easy to forget how much grief both Happ and Suzuki were getting before the All-Star break last season. Happ had 11 of his 21 HR's in Aug/Sep. Suzuki hit 12 of his 20 HR's in Aug/Sep and his average rose from .255 to .285 after the All Star break. Hopefully, both guys can replicate their last 2 months- but if not there should be at-bats for guys in the pipeline.
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I'm with you on Happ but the Suzuki from the last two months is real.

He settled down and looked like the guy we thought we signed. He got out of his head, found food that he liked in the states and got his wife and baby settled in. He's ready to go.
 
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CYdTracked said:
Giving Happ a no trade clause when you already have another corner OF with one was just a stupid move by the front office. I have nothing against Happ but the Cubs have missed the mark more than once to trade him when he had good trade value on a cheaper contract. They also gave him that contract fully knowing there was a bunch of OF prospect depth they could eventually replace him with. I also think if he wasn't on the roster right now they probably would have given in and resigned Bellinger to a long term deal too. Happ is an above average OF but he's not a star nor do I think he ever will be much more than he is right now which is a solid defender and probably going to bat somewhere around .250 or about with about 15-20 HR and around 70 RBI most years.

Won't know until we see them get their shot in Chicago but I think some of the OF guys are possibly going to have higher ceilings than Happ when it comes to hitting for power. I think with Bellinger it comes down to are you committed to giving your prospects a fair shot in the majors when they are ready or are you going to commit to Belli over the long haul and start making deals from your prospect surplus. There are guys both at 1B and OF that are going to be impact players or may not cut it in the majors, we just don't know and the more guys you have in the mix at a position the less runway they are going to get when they get called up probably.

I could probably stomach Chapman on a deal no more than 3 years because he's a solid 3B glove and fills a bigger position need right now even if he may be regressing some offensively. I wouldn't be against adding another starting pitcher to the rotation either as a counter move to not being able to sign a big name bat as good pitching will usually keep you in games. Right now its Steele, Hendricks, Shota, Taillon then someone out of Assad, Wicks, Smyly, and Wesneski fighting it out for that 5th spot. I don't find anything wrong with adding another proven veteran starter to the rotation given we don't know what to expect out of that 5th spot plus both Hendricks and Taillon can be a mixed bag at times and you will have the inevitable injury at some point. Would allow Assad and Smyly to work out of the bullpen as long arms where they were effective last season and can have Wicks and Wesneski stay stretched out as a starter in Iowa to start the season as injury depth.
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Caissie and Alcantara will open 2024 at AA so they aren't likely to sniff Chicago till almost 2026. Those are our top Corner OF options. Prior to that we have Canario whom from what I've seen in Des Moines is a below average fielder with a strong arm (ala Morel) and Davis who's a big if health wise.

Just a guess but PCA should hopefully own CF by 2025.

Canario probably tops out as a DH/reserve OF.

Davis at this point is a Longshot.

Then law of averages says out of Caissie-Alcantara one will stick.

If true that means we still need one vet beyond 2026.

All said and done I'm fine with living with Tauchman till PCA is ready. Not good for 2024 but long-term it allows us to sign a quality starter.
 
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