Principal Financial-Remote work

[cowgirl836]

India?

Can't be. Dads get 15 days, moms get up to 26 weeks. The US is literally bottom five in the world on this issue (fun fact, 25% of women are back at work within 10 DAYS of giving birth!. And it's countries like Papua New Guinea and Swaziland rounding it out. I'm really curious which country he's referencing because either there's some complicating factor like not enough consecutive weeks of work to attain the full country benefit or something else going on. There's a chunk like China, New Zealand (very surprising), and Russia that don't offer paternity leave but I can't even find a country that measures their overall leave in days, not weeks or months.

 

[Drew0311]

I think this is temporary. In 5-10 years, some corner offices will have a genious idea to bring everyone under one roof to "reinvigorate company cultures." And the open offices/cheap rent will also help.

While WFH has its place, I do not think all or nothing works. Hybrid for sure, but all WFH will not last imo. Being a shut in and only communicating by instant message is the reason our country is so divided. We literally read between the lines way too much because we only communicate in text and so much is left unclear and thus, uncommunicated.

How in the hell do you onboard new college grads from their dining room table? You don't, errr you dont do it well. Probably a contributor to Gen Z bouncing from job to job with ease.

My whole department minus a few people have WFH for 7 years. Way before the Covid. No way we will ever move back.

 

[CascadeClone]

My whole department minus a few people have WFH for 7 years. Way before the Covid. No way we will ever move back.

Whats the role/department?

Guessing it isnt shipping & receiving...

 

[Jeremy]

I like what we've developed. Depending on position, people are required to be in the office 2 or 3 days a week - whatever days they want. For a select few, I let them be remote all the time.

There is a "one team" day about every 3 weeks where everybody is expected to be in the office. That day is used for town halls, charity events, etc rather than just checking a box. Every meeting automatically has a Microsoft Teams meeting setup so it doesn't matter if you're in the building or not.

What I find really interesting is that I loved working from home when I knew I had a choice. I knew I could go in any time I wanted, connect with people (not really my thing), etc. But now that I'm struggling with Parkinson's and permanently remote, it's much different knowing you don't really get those chances.

I think flexibility is the key to managing happiness and a healthy, collaborative environment.

 

[Drew0311]

Whats the role/department?

Guessing it isnt shipping & receiving...

It's nothing that we have to be their physically to do. Obviously those type of jobs have to be at the office. I am in sales. However, my company has 55k employees and I would guess 1k of them work in an office somewhere around the world. I think the IT department, the guys who fix and issue computers, are in the office. Other than that, everyone is home.

 

[exCyDing]

I think this is temporary. In 5-10 years, some corner offices will have a genious idea to bring everyone under one roof to "reinvigorate company cultures." And the open offices/cheap rent will also help.

While WFH has its place, I do not think all or nothing works. Hybrid for sure, but all WFH will not last imo. Being a shut in and only communicating by instant message is the reason our country is so divided. We literally read between the lines way too much because we only communicate in text and so much is left unclear and thus, uncommunicated.

How in the hell do you onboard new college grads from their dining room table? You don't, errr you dont do it well. Probably a contributor to Gen Z bouncing from job to job with ease.

I could see a push for in-office work in a couple years when rents crater, but it's really going to vary by industry. Some will have a tougher time getting employees back, or attracting new employees if that's all they're offering. If they're offering in-office only, they can recruit from a (maybe) 50 mile radius of where they're located. If they offer remote, they can recruit nation (or, theoretically, world) wide. Again, it might not be a problem in some industries, but might be a big difference for others.

IMO, the onboarding fears are overblown. Most companies have always done pretty **** job of onboarding, and there are plenty of ways to effectively get employees up and running if they put the resources into it. Just doing things the way they did in person isn't going to work, they'll have to adapt and adjust.

Gen Z bounces from job to job with ease because they've figured out it's usually more effective to get a raise or promotion through the job hunt rather than waiting around. That, and it's not like corporations have a great track record of being loyal to their employees (see: tech companies going through layoffs earlier this year despite record profits because analysts decided the stock market wanted to see some performative "fat cutting"). Ultimately, employers control that dynamic, and could change it if they wanted to.

I'm late Gen Xer, but did a career reboot in a new industry 7 years ago. I'm on my 4th company. The first move was for a role that better fit my skill set, the rest have all been for 20-30% pay raises. Two companies put off promised raises and that was my cue to hit the streets. I'm all for company loyalty, but it's a two way street. If they're not going to be loyal with pay, I'll find someone who is.

 

[Urbandale2013]

I like what we've developed. Depending on position, people are required to be in the office 2 or 3 days a week - whatever days they want. For a select few, I let them be remote all the time.

There is a "one team" day about every 3 weeks where everybody is expected to be in the office. That day is used for town halls, charity events, etc rather than just checking a box. Every meeting automatically has a Microsoft Teams meeting setup so it doesn't matter if you're in the building or not.

What I find really interesting is that I loved working from home when I knew I had a choice. I knew I could go in any time I wanted, connect with people (not really my thing), etc. But now that I'm struggling with Parkinson's and permanently remote, it's much different knowing you don't really get those chances.

I think flexibility is the key to managing happiness and a healthy, collaborative environment.

Like you said the key is flexibility. Having in person and remote options is important. I’m still in the office 100% but am looking to be remote on a more regular basis in the next year or so because of some technology upgrades. I can do just as much if not more from home.

It’s called managers need to learn how to manage. The WFH complaints from managers are just people who don’t want to or don’t have the skills to successfully manage people. There will always be people who need to be in the office but that shouldn’t be a blanket approach.

 

[SCNCY]

Question is then for the PFG employees hired preCovid. Since they were hired in office, you are saying they can’t complain if they are called in by what you posted.

I think a reevaluation of a persons role and location needs to be had. When I took my current job, it was hybrid with Monday and Friday being home, and Tuesday, Wednesday, and Thursday in office. I had that expectation going in, and that's what I expect going in the future. As we've discussed on here, companies who commit to a flexible schedule or a WFH culture save money because they 1) don't pay building maintenance or rent, and 2) reduced turnover due to more satisfied employees.

For those employees hired pre-covid, the world has changed where a reevaluation of employee working locations and building leases needs to be looked at to reduce costs; whether off loading office space or letting leases expire.

 

[CascadeClone]

It's nothing that we have to be their physically to do. Obviously those type of jobs have to be at the office. I am in sales. However, my company has 55k employees and I would guess 1k of them work in an office somewhere around the world. I think the IT department, the guys who fix and issue computers, are in the office. Other than that, everyone is home.

It sounds like they have the remote work logistics really figured out, accepted, and embedded in company culture. That's great. Most places are not that far along, to say the least!

 

[cowgirl836]

I like what we've developed. Depending on position, people are required to be in the office 2 or 3 days a week - whatever days they want. For a select few, I let them be remote all the time.

There is a "one team" day about every 3 weeks where everybody is expected to be in the office. That day is used for town halls, charity events, etc rather than just checking a box. Every meeting automatically has a Microsoft Teams meeting setup so it doesn't matter if you're in the building or not.

What I find really interesting is that I loved working from home when I knew I had a choice. I knew I could go in any time I wanted, connect with people (not really my thing), etc. But now that I'm struggling with Parkinson's and permanently remote, it's much different knowing you don't really get those chances.

I think flexibility is the key to managing happiness and a healthy, collaborative environment.

To me that is the biggest gap I see in these RTOs. Make the in-office days PURPOSEFUL. Onboarding new employees. Team meetings. Whatever it is that you think benefits from in person collaboration/training. Don't just mandate 10 days a month in office but everyone picks different days or the bulk of the team sits in a different location so it's all just people sitting on Teams calls anyway. Still make it accessible for people who have a sick kid, appt they need to make - whatever, but try to make those office days have purpose.

 

[Jeremy]

To me that is the biggest gap I see in these RTOs. Make the in-office days PURPOSEFUL. Onboarding new employees. Team meetings. Whatever it is that you think benefits from in person collaboration/training. Don't just mandate 10 days a month in office but everyone picks different days or the bulk of the team sits in a different location so it's all just people sitting on Teams calls anyway. Still make it accessible for people who have a sick kid, appt they need to make - whatever, but try to make those office days have purpose.

Absolutely agree. When we had leadership meetings about how to return to the office, I can't count how many times I said there has to be a reason/purpose for people to be in person or you're doing it for the wrong reasons.

Executives like a lot of face-to-face discussions and think that everybody works better that way, but worker-bees often don't. Managers don't like to take the time or have the skills to properly manage people remotely, that's not the workers' fault.

I understand the arguments about collaboration and all of that, but I ran 7 meetings yesterday without being distracted in the office by using Teams, Jira, Whiteboard, OneNote, etc. I guarantee you I would have had 10x more drive-bys in person than I had on Teams, or they'd take much longer.

 

[TitanClone]

India?

No chance. My India cohorts get like 6 or 9 months, not sure what the dads get. Granted on the US side both mom and dad get 14 weeks and don't have to use it all consecutively. One guy on my team just got back from using 8 and is going to take the remaining 6 when his wife's 14 run out.

 

[TitanClone]

I think this is temporary. In 5-10 years, some corner offices will have a genious idea to bring everyone under one roof to "reinvigorate company cultures." And the open offices/cheap rent will also help.

While WFH has its place, I do not think all or nothing works. Hybrid for sure, but all WFH will not last imo. Being a shut in and only communicating by instant message is the reason our country is so divided. We literally read between the lines way too much because we only communicate in text and so much is left unclear and thus, uncommunicated.

How in the hell do you onboard new college grads from their dining room table? You don't, errr you dont do it well. Probably a contributor to Gen Z bouncing from job to job with ease.

I've onboarded 4 new college grads since we went to WFH in April 2020 without a problem. 3 are people we wouldn't have gotten due to location without WFH. Pretty simple, lot's of video calls and sharing screens to walk through things, assigning each of them a Sr. Engineer as a dedicated mentor. Granted there have been times it would have been easier to get up and walk over to their desk overall it's been a none issue.

 

[Gunnerclone]

I've onboarded 4 new college grads since we went to WFH in April 2020 without a problem. 3 are people we wouldn't have gotten due to location without WFH. Pretty simple, lot's of video calls and sharing screens to walk through things, assigning each of them a Sr. Engineer as a dedicated mentor. Granted there have been times it would have been easier to get up and walk over to their desk overall it's been a none issue.

Imagine thinking a 20-something can’t figure things out or even PREFERS to figure things out in a virtual/internet based ecosystem.

 

[BCClone]

I think a reevaluation of a persons role and location needs to be had. When I took my current job, it was hybrid with Monday and Friday being home, and Tuesday, Wednesday, and Thursday in office. I had that expectation going in, and that's what I expect going in the future. As we've discussed on here, companies who commit to a flexible schedule or a WFH culture save money because they 1) don't pay building maintenance or rent, and 2) reduced turnover due to more satisfied employees.

For those employees hired pre-covid, the world has changed where a reevaluation of employee working locations and building leases needs to be looked at to reduce costs; whether off loading office space or letting leases expire.

If they reevaluated your job and said, hey, we think you need to be on the office 4-5 days a week, you would be okay with that?

 

[BCClone]

I think this is temporary. In 5-10 years, some corner offices will have a genious idea to bring everyone under one roof to "reinvigorate company cultures." And the open offices/cheap rent will also help.

While WFH has its place, I do not think all or nothing works. Hybrid for sure, but all WFH will not last imo. Being a shut in and only communicating by instant message is the reason our country is so divided. We literally read between the lines way too much because we only communicate in text and so much is left unclear and thus, uncommunicated.

How in the hell do you onboard new college grads from their dining room table? You don't, errr you dont do it well. Probably a contributor to Gen Z bouncing from job to job with ease.

My daughter had an internship this summer where most were work from home so she had to email or call for help. She said it was a lot of wasted time and felt she learned little. She decided that was not a company she wants to work for even though current employees say they love it. She also said several new office employees quit during her time there stating lack of support when they had issues.

The new college grads will be the tough ones to hold in a large wfh base.

 

[BCClone]

I've onboarded 4 new college grads since we went to WFH in April 2020 without a problem. 3 are people we wouldn't have gotten due to location without WFH. Pretty simple, lot's of video calls and sharing screens to walk through things, assigning each of them a Sr. Engineer as a dedicated mentor. Granted there have been times it would have been easier to get up and walk over to their desk overall it's been a none issue.

I think a lot of it comes down to what area it is.

 

[KnappShack]

Imagine thinking a 20-something can’t figure things out or even PREFERS to figure things out in a virtual/internet based ecosystem.

The world was never the same after smoking in the office wasn't permitted.

A goddam suit, tie, and an ashtray on the desk.

That's when mother ******* got work done. None of this WFH horse ****.

 

[Ms3r4ISU]

Absolutely agree. When we had leadership meetings about how to return to the office, I can't count how many times I said there has to be a reason/purpose for people to be in person or you're doing it for the wrong reasons.

Executives like a lot of face-to-face discussions and think that everybody works better that way, but worker-bees often don't. Managers don't like to take the time or have the skills to properly manage people remotely, that's not the workers' fault.

I understand the arguments about collaboration and all of that, but I ran 7 meetings yesterday without being distracted in the office by using Teams, Jira, Whiteboard, OneNote, etc. I guarantee you I would have had 10x more drive-bys in person than I had on Teams, or they'd take much longer.

But were you distracted by CF?

 

[SCNCY]

If they reevaluated your job and said, hey, we think you need to be on the office 4-5 days a week, you would be okay with that?

No, because the job I got and started a month ago was advertised as hybrid. Those who got jobs before Covid were just assumed to be in office, and since the job world has changed, companies should reevaluate those employees to determine if they can have a remote, hybrid, or in office work since they didn’t really get the opportunity I had.