***Official Big 12 Expansion Thread '16***

[cyIclSoneU]

I would trade the OK and KS schools, keep 9 games with cross overs

West vs. East
BYU vs TCU
ISU vs WVU
KSU vs UH
KU vs OSU
UT vs OU
TTU vs BU

There are tons of ways to do it with crossovers and that would work.

But, a nearly perfect east/west geographic split wouldn't even need crossovers if you were willing to forego TCU-BU every year.

BYU
TCU
Texas
Texas Tech
Oklahoma
Oklahoma State

Baylor
Houston
Iowa State
Kansas
Kansas State
West Virginia

This would make sense if the Big 12 wanted to emulate the B1G's weak/strong divisions and have a strong Big 12 West.

 

[CyArob]

8 game conference schedule with 12 teams/6 team divisions just works so much better than 9 game conference schedules. Curse you money!

 

[cyIclSoneU]

8 game conference schedule with 12 teams/6 team divisions just works so much better than 9 game conference schedules. Curse you money!

ESPN and FOX could make more money off an 8 game conference schedule with two guaranteed Power 5 non-cons. The ACC is on that model with more than 12 teams.

Iowa State could play an FCS warm-up, a MAC school, Iowa, and another Power 5 of its choosing - probably another team looking for an easier matchup to get to 6 wins, like a Boston College, Wake Forest, Vanderbilt, etc. - and then 8 Big 12 games

 

[isucy86]

I think the Big 12 will learn from the B1G's lessons and not do this. (At least, I hope.)

There's a pretty good argument that one strong division and one weak one is the best way for a conference to get in the playoff. I don't think that's the reason for the B1G's West and East, but it's a happy side effect that the conference is glad exists.

I think that has helped the Big10 in the first two years of the playoff system. But I think they were lucky. In year one, the Big12 messed up by not having a clear champ. If we did the arguement against Ohio State would have been they played a patsy in their CCG. I also think the Big10 has been lucky that Michigan and Penn State have been down the last 4-5 years. If the east becomes top heavy with OSU, UM, MSU and PSU- I think you will hear some complaining.

Ideally, I think a conference wants its top 4 teams evenly split. Then one division can be heavy with mid pack teams to make geographic sense.

 

[CyArob]

ESPN and FOX could make more money off an 8 game conference schedule with two guaranteed Power 5 non-cons. The ACC is on that model with more than 12 teams.

Iowa State could play an FCS warm-up, a MAC school, Iowa, and another Power 5 of its choosing - probably another team looking for an easier matchup to get to 6 wins, like a Boston College, Wake Forest, Vanderbilt, etc. - and then 8 Big 12 games

True. I was thinking more so the schedule that we had back in the late 1990's/early 2000's where we got to play each team home and away every 4 years and how that would be messed up if there were 9 Big 12 games with 12 teams.

 

[isucy86]

ESPN and FOX could make more money off an 8 game conference schedule with two guaranteed Power 5 non-cons. The ACC is on that model with more than 12 teams.

Iowa State could play an FCS warm-up, a MAC school, Iowa, and another Power 5 of its choosing - probably another team looking for an easier matchup to get to 6 wins, like a Boston College, Wake Forest, Vanderbilt, etc. - and then 8 Big 12 games

Problem is the Pac12, Big10 and Big12 all play 9 confernce games. I think there is going to be pressure on the ACC and SEC to add a 9th conference game. There was a story on ESPN a few weeks ago where Jimbo Fischer was saying the playing field needed to be level to get a playoff berth.

Also, with 12 & 14 team conferences, it makes sense to play more not less conference games to ensure teams in opposing divisions play more than a couple times a decade.

 

[isucy86]

If BYU and Houston are the two adds, I would hate to see ISU, KU and KSU in different divisions. I think it is critical to keep geographic rivals. I would go with the following split:

North Division
Texas
OU
OSU
KU
KSU
ISU

South Division
TCU
Baylor
Houston
Texas Tech
West Virginia
BYU

Texas is the only Texas school in its dvision, but with 4 games against the other division, the will have 2 or 3 games against Texas schools each year.

 

[HoopsTournament]

If BYU and Houston are the two adds, I would hate to see ISU, KU and KSU in different divisions. I think it is critical to keep geographic rivals. I would go with the following split:

North Division
Texas
OU
OSU
KU
KSU
ISU

South Division
TCU
Baylor
Houston
Texas Tech
West Virginia
BYU

Texas is the only Texas school in its dvision, but with 4 games against the other division, the will have 2 or 3 games against Texas schools each year.

I don't think that will happen. However, I could see Texas and WVU being flipped where BYU joins the 5 Texas teams and WVU joins the 5 Big 8 teams.

You would still need crossover to keep UT-OU rivalry.

Others don't really matter, but here are possibilities:

ISU - BYU
KU - Tech
KSU - Baylor
OSU - TCU
WVU - Houston

So if you have 1 guaranteed crossover, you would have 5 division, 1 crossover and 3 rotating out of other 5. I assume there would be a 2-year cycle of playing the same team.

So for ISU, play the following:

2017-18: Texas, Tech, Houston
2019-20: TCU, Baylor, Texas
2021-22: Tech, Houston, TCU
2023-24: Baylor, Texas, Tech
2025-26: Houston, TCU, Baylor

So we would play each of the 5 teams 6 times in 10 years. After the 10 year period, we would switch our crossover opponent based on order of finish during the last x years.

 

[alarson]

I'll be disappointed if its Houston and BYU. Those are the 2 candidates i want no part of.

We dont need BYU, theyre extremely overrated as an option, yet they have the attitude theyre texas. We certainly dont need a 5th team in Texas. If UCF is truly not under consideration, the big 12 is once again being shortsighted, IMO.

 

[HoopsTournament]

My preferred divisions would be (but not sure it would happen):

Division 1:
WVU
ISU
KU
KSU
BU
TCU

Division 2:
OU
OSU
UT
TTU
UH
BYU

With this there would be no crossovers.

ISU's schedule would be 5 in division and 4 from other division:

Example
2017-18: BYU, UH, OU, OSU
2019-20: UT, TTU, BYU, UH
2021-22: OU, OSU, UT, TTU

Every 6 years, we would play each team from the other division 4 times. Four year players will play each team home and away at least once and most twice.

 

[HoopsTournament]

I'll be disappointed if its Houston and BYU. Those are the 2 candidates i want no part of.

We dont need BYU, theyre extremely overrated as an option, yet they have the attitude theyre texas. We certainly dont need a 5th team in Texas. If UCF is truly not under consideration, the big 12 is once again being shortsighted, IMO.

If this is what the networks want and gets us a GOR extension than I am very happy. It could be Drake and South Dakota for all I care if it extended the GOR. (Note: the networks would not extend the GOR for Drake and South Dakota.)

As for being overrated, this is about market penetration and market penetration only. BYU is the number one team by far for market penetration. As for Houston, it is political. See my comment about the GOR. Houston may be the difference between Texas signing the GOR and not signing it. So saying we don't "need" a 5th Texas team is a matter of perspective. If it is the difference between the Big 12 still being in existence in 10 years and not being in existence, then we do "need" them.

 

[HoopsTournament]

Just can't see ISU in the ACC. At some point ND is going to be forced to join the ACC if they want in the playoff. The is going to be a push for parity for teams to be eligible for a playoff berth- 9 conference games, 1 P5 non-con and conference has a championship game.

That leaves one spot and even with ND, they will still feel pressure to add a FB power and they would take a run at Texas or OU. If they can't grab a FB power they go for UConn.

I disagree. The playoff will be expanded to 8 teams within the next 10 years. There will be no need at that point for ND to be in a conference. ND's conference schedule has always been at the level of any P5 conference team that they don't need to be in a conference for "parity". And even if every conference has 9 games with 1 P5 non-con game, there will not be parity. Look at SEC and Big 10 right now where divisions have one strong division and one weak division.

 

[cyIclSoneU]

Problem is the Pac12, Big10 and Big12 all play 9 confernce games. I think there is going to be pressure on the ACC and SEC to add a 9th conference game. There was a story on ESPN a few weeks ago where Jimbo Fischer was saying the playing field needed to be level to get a playoff berth.

Also, with 12 & 14 team conferences, it makes sense to play more not less conference games to ensure teams in opposing divisions play more than a couple times a decade.

I don't think there's really any pressure on the ACC or SEC to go to 9 games as it is. There is far more noise about the Big 12's lack of a CCG than over those conference's 8-game schedules, and they both have 14 teams.

I think the Big 12 would enjoy the flexibility of an 8 game conference slate with two Power 5 non-cons, just like the ACC currently does it. It allows each school more of an opportunity to schedule to its own needs.

Strong schools like OU could go out and search for other strong schools to try to build the resume for a playoff run. (See USC-Alabama being played the first weekend.) And weaker schools like Iowa State will find each other in the hunt for 6 wins and a bowl. ESPN and FOX will like it for that first reason - more marquee hand-crafted matchups that they can promote and put in prime time. And with 8 conference games plus 2 Power 5 non-cons, if each school on average plays one of those two as a home game (or as the "home" team on a neutral field), then the Big 12 contract contains the same amount of inventory as it would for a 9 game conference slate.

As for playing teams more often, the 12 team/8 game schedule is what the Big 12 used from inception all the way through 2010. Play everyone in your division plus half of the other division. Next year, same teams but flip home/away. Year 3, play everyone in your division plus the other half of the other division. Etc.

 

[cygrads]

My preferred divisions would be (but not sure it would happen):

Example
2017-18: BYU, UH, OU, OSU
2019-20: UT, TTU, BYU, UH
2021-22: OU, OSU, UT, TTU

Every 6 years, we would play each team from the other division 4 times. Four year players will play each team home and away at least once and most twice.

So basically as often as we play UNI. I know big conferences are the future but a 10 school conference is so much better - the goal should be to form 8 ten school conferences and those 8 conferences negotiating together for TV rights and share the money - yes I know this will never happen.

 

[HFCS]

So basically as often as we play UNI. I know big conferences are the future but a 10 school conference is so much better - the goal should be to form 8 ten school conferences and those 8 conferences negotiating together for TV rights and share the money - yes I know this will never happen.

I agree in "unlimited hypothetical power" world this is exactly what I'd do. You get to promote about 15 non P5 programs which gets rid of any arguments of people being squeezed out of something they were previously a part of and feeds into one of the best post seasons in sports, post season being the only area where college football lags for me compared to other sports. Sports are better when there are lots of local rivalries and this would increase that. Within a few yearss maybe Washington/Boise State, BYU/Colorado, Pitt/PSU, Florida/Miami, ISU/Minnesota become rivalries where there wasn't much of one previously in addition to whatever current rivalries they have going.

Best of all it still makes the regular season absolutely huge where every single game can knock someone out of the title needing to win a 10 team conference. The only area that takes a hit is non-conf games would become a little more of an exhibition, but that would be the case in any scenario where conference champs make up a significant portion of playoff births.

 

[Gunnerclone]

But that backs up my point. We are relegated to the worst channels and time slots because we bring very few viewers. TCU gets prime spots because far more people watch their games.

I realize that's not because they have a huge alumni base, etc. But they win and people love watching teams that win.

They are also in Dallas/FW which has over twice as many people as the state of Iowa.

Maybe in a couple years Campell will have us winning 11-12 games regularly. That is the only way to get more apples to apples.

We are relegated to the worst time slots because we are terrible. We can change that.

 

[sheepplucker]

My preferred divisions would be (but not sure it would happen):

Division 1:
WVU
ISU
KU
KSU
BU
TCU

Division 2:
OU
OSU
UT
TTU
UH
BYU

With this there would be no crossovers.

ISU's schedule would be 5 in division and 4 from other division:

Example
2017-18: BYU, UH, OU, OSU
2019-20: UT, TTU, BYU, UH
2021-22: OU, OSU, UT, TTU

Every 6 years, we would play each team from the other division 4 times. Four year players will play each team home and away at least once and most twice.

I say switch BU and TCU for OU and OSU. Let the state of Texas beat up on each other since we need yet another Texas school in the big 12 . The division's can be Texas + 1 and then the big 12 north

 

[HoopsTournament]

Another saying BYU/UH but with an earlier announcement.

 

[MeanDean]

Another saying BYU/UH but with an earlier announcement.

Houston was my 4th choice:
1. BYU
2. Cinci
3. UConn

 

[KnappShack]

Another saying BYU/UH but with an earlier announcement.

I was waiting for Teacup Pigs to weigh in....