Wow. Hadn't put the pieces together.
We were tied or in the lead late in the 4th Q against 2 of the 5 remaining undefeated teams!
Am I the Only One?
- Thread starter Fanatic1973
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Wow. Hadn't put the pieces together.
We were tied or in the lead late in the 4th Q against 2 of the 5 remaining undefeated teams!
Really, you are comparing fans clamoring for a firing after a bowl loss to fans calling for a firing after almost 3 seasons and a total of 8 wins?
Listen, Paul could still prove me wrong and win the last 2 games, that might be enough to not have me ****** that he's back next year, but if we have 3 wins at the end of this season, there is no amount of "improvement" that should keep him around. No matter what though, I just don't think he's the guy to take this team forward.
I guess I'm not watching the same football team that everyone else who's on the Rhoads bandwagon is watching. This season is exactly like last year, only we were able to not choke the Texas game down our legs. Instead, we did that against OSU and Iowa by only putting 7 points on the board total, in the second half of those games. And we traded a FCS win for a non P5 loss. We still struggle against teams we should be able to beat and really suck against most of the big boys.
I guess I can't find any moral victories in big losses to TTech, TCU, Baylor, and OU. I look at this season and think, yeah, another ISU football season, same as it always was. Rhoads always finds a way to take one game, this year OSU, and make it competitive enough that people jump up and say, "It's all changed!" It hasn't, going back to when we did beat OSU. That win is actually what seals the deal for me and CPR. That created so much buzz for ISU and all he did with it, was make us one of the worst teams in FBS.
I'm not sure what side of the debate I am on yet. Earlier this season I was ready to pull the plug on this staff but after I let things settle down I do see some improvement so I'm not sure if I'm ready to hit the reboot button yet considering the competition we'd have to fill a coaching vacancy plus a likely step back before we might step forward again by doing that. I just took our scores from last year compared to this year and here are some interesting numbers:
Wins: knocking out the obvious here, 1 more win than this time last year
Total points for/against: 259/324 this year compared to 251/374 last year so offense has been about the same, defense a little better so far
Average point differential: -6.5 points to -12.3 last season, this is quite an improvement from last year. We have a shutout this year and our worst loss was by 36 to OU where last year it was 45 to OU as well. Last year we had 4 games we lost by 20+ this year 3 games
It's not a huge improvement but I think the point differential is showing that we are making strides at at least competing in games where this time last year we were just crushed emotionally and checked out of games by halftime if not sooner. It they can win these last 2 I think that point differential wil probably creep to less than -5 for the season and we'd also have 3 more wins than last year. If they split these games I'm really torn on what to do with Rhoads, I said before the season 5 wins keeps him in the conversation for keeping his job depending on who we competed and considering we competed with OSU this past weekend and could have thrown in the towl against Baylor but looked a lot more competitive after switching QBs I think that works in his favor some.
Winning 6 games this year really would have quieted down the critics for now and ben a sure sign of improvment, just so much interpretation on how to define improvement right now that I really am on the fence on which way I will lean at the end of the season and these last 2 games might sway me to 1 side or the other depending on outcome and how we look on the field. Win both and do it looking good and on both sides of the ball and I'd probably be OK with another year of Rhoads, lose either of them or look really sloppy in a loss in either game and I may have a hard time convincing myself we're making significant enough improvement to stay the course. We do have a lot of young talent at skill positions but the lines on both sides are going to have to improve for us to get the most out of them.
Wins: knocking out the obvious here, 1 more win than this time last year
Total points for/against: 259/324 this year compared to 251/374 last year so offense has been about the same, defense a little better so far
Average point differential: -6.5 points to -12.3 last season, this is quite an improvement from last year. We have a shutout this year and our worst loss was by 36 to OU where last year it was 45 to OU as well. Last year we had 4 games we lost by 20+ this year 3 games
It's not a huge improvement but I think the point differential is showing that we are making strides at at least competing in games where this time last year we were just crushed emotionally and checked out of games by halftime if not sooner. It they can win these last 2 I think that point differential wil probably creep to less than -5 for the season and we'd also have 3 more wins than last year. If they split these games I'm really torn on what to do with Rhoads, I said before the season 5 wins keeps him in the conversation for keeping his job depending on who we competed and considering we competed with OSU this past weekend and could have thrown in the towl against Baylor but looked a lot more competitive after switching QBs I think that works in his favor some.
Winning 6 games this year really would have quieted down the critics for now and ben a sure sign of improvment, just so much interpretation on how to define improvement right now that I really am on the fence on which way I will lean at the end of the season and these last 2 games might sway me to 1 side or the other depending on outcome and how we look on the field. Win both and do it looking good and on both sides of the ball and I'd probably be OK with another year of Rhoads, lose either of them or look really sloppy in a loss in either game and I may have a hard time convincing myself we're making significant enough improvement to stay the course. We do have a lot of young talent at skill positions but the lines on both sides are going to have to improve for us to get the most out of them.
Do do you also give Rhoads credit for getting us a big lead? Or does he only get credit for the bad stuff?
...and that's awesome if you're into moral victories. I see it as another bowl game ****** down our leg because we have a sub-par coaching staff.
The players have not quit. They are playing hard. Lots of frustration when you lose a game like that against an undefeated Top 5 team.
We will have to see how the players respond. Their coach's job is on the line. Everyone knows it.
Changing the staff now would be a huge disservice to the ENORMOUS senior class this program will have next fall. A staff change will almost certainly guarantee another losing season. ISU isn't equipped to turn things around quickly like the Michigans and Auburns of the world. The players deserve one more shot with this staff barring a complete meltdown against KSU & WVU.
Another Support/Don't support Paul thread. Cool.
The facts remain the same. We're not winning games. I don't give 2 ***** who our opponents are. A loss is a loss.
Let me guess Fanatic1973, you're also in favor of kids getting trophies for last place.
Quit it with the crap. Go cheer for Paul when he takes over for Pezetti and Centennial in a couple years, he has no business at Iowa State any longer.
The facts remain the same. We're not winning games. I don't give 2 ***** who our opponents are. A loss is a loss.
Let me guess Fanatic1973, you're also in favor of kids getting trophies for last place.
Quit it with the crap. Go cheer for Paul when he takes over for Pezetti and Centennial in a couple years, he has no business at Iowa State any longer.
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In the end, PR does not win games. His best coaching is low average, his worst coaching is abysmal. We've been sold the "hometown boy" schtick and promises about "next year" for season after season.
So many of us are grasping at straws to justify keeping him. I'm no longer buying.
So many of us are grasping at straws to justify keeping him. I'm no longer buying.
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Or the coaches who helped us be in such a great position on Saturday may be "this close" to a great season next year. That is not a moral victory. That is paying attention to the fact that we had an undefeated team on the ropes!
I guess I'm just confused on the reasons people are in support of Rhoads here. A lot of people are acting like we are in the third year of his tenure. Like somehow he took over this loser team and is working to improve it. It's year 7. His best year was his first year. Every year since then has been a regression from that year. There is no such thing as "improvement" when we are talking about a coach winning 3 games in his 7th season. I mean heck, hopefully by year 14 he can get us back to that 6-6 mark and losing bowl games.
He's been here long enough that we can establish a pattern now. He's working with his guys and has been for a few years now. Since having his own guys, the team has gone down hill significantly since his first year, he has yet to show that he and his staff can in any way develop a player beyond what they are when they get here, and worst of all, he still finds ways to get absolutely smoked by more than a couple of teams a year.
I'm sorry, I just don't see improvement, I see more of the same.
And about the bolded part, are we blocking out the OU loss this year or did I dream that game?
no coach has ever taken us to many bowl games. I'm not sure that pipe dream can be achieved. B12 is gonna have to expand for that to be an option for any coach at ISU.
There are several reasons CPR will be the coach next year but that senior class will be one of the big ones. You run a very high risk of wasting that class bringing in another coach. You add that to the number of open P5 jobs, the buyout, the obvious improvement over last year as well as the 2nd half of the season and it all adds up to CPR in 2016.
As if it's not hard enough to get a quality coach to Ames you are basically selling a coach on a talented senior class that will not know your system and an almost guarantee you take a step back in year 2. Most coaches I think want talented youth, not talented seniors. They want to show sustained improvement, not a "decent" first year followed by a marked regression in wins.
The problem is that I look around at some of the talent sprinkled in this team (Tucker, Pierson, Jones, Peavy, Floyd, all the WRs, Warren, Lalk, usually the guards) and I believe it's probably one of, if not the most talented teams we have had and we will win 5 games at best. That's unacceptable. This roster should be no worse than a seven win team and I would argue 8 or 9 wins should be very possible. I truly believe there are only 4 teams on our schedule with more raw talent and we beat the one that can't put it together. We got smoked by the other three. Then we lost to two others that I don't believe are as talented and two more remain. If those are my beliefs, why should I believe that will change next year when our best pieces of the Oline are gone? It's hard for me to think that we all of a sudden just start winning some of these games. Second half letdowns, to me are indicative of coaching failure at some level. We have lost every game that's been a game at half time and lost one that we were dominating. Hell maybe two we were dominating depending on how you look at Iowa. Oklahoma was a game and we laid down. We got Baylor to a point where a big play changes how that game looks and then did nothing with it.
We've been competitive for the most part and that's an improvement. The problem is that when we are in a spot to go ahead and win games against quality teams, we can't. We can't score and we can't get stops in those scenarios.
Yea what gets lost is that he's done all this while not really playing in the first 2 games.
You must be a bunch of young Cyclone fans. I went to school in the early 1970's. I remember all being mediocre years except when Earl Bruce and Johnny Majors were the coaches. Donnie Duncan, Walden, Chizek, need I go on. McCarney took us to how many bowl games? You were spoiled by the first three years CPR was here and think we are in a position to do that each year. We are not there yet and no one has ever gotten us there since I was in college. I just want to see improvement on a consistent basis. Someday we will be there and be able to compete on a consistent basis. I get tired of throwing away all the progress that has been made to change coaches with the pipe dream of being 8-4 or better every year.
Well, when you have little to no room for error & you have no clue what down it is despite the chain gang being right in front of you & numerous coaches & grad assistants, etc as well as knowing in the college game the clock stops when a first down is achieved to get the chains set - all of this yet we did not know what down it was.
That is entirely on the staff - yet, the comments made after the game kind of place the blame on the players (wow) & I have a difficult time wanting to give the leader of this group 1 more shot.
Then, we have added a lot more talent in the past 2 years & do not want to break up the group responsible for that if they can replicate it for next year. JC PLAYERS: Demond Tucker - leader of the D there. He played more snaps as players behind him are injured (Aka, I believe) - but look what he did playing more snaps. Maybe our 1's need to play a little bit more, tired or not. Jay Jones - playmaker. Jhaustin Thomas - flashes (been injured twice by opposing linemen cut-blocking right at his knees). Wiltz - probably our best DB at actually playing the ball. Philbert - JC coming in with 3 years to play & gets in the rotation. Pierson - like D Tucker played more snaps as we've had our depth depleted & he produced big-time Saturday & is on the verge of breaking the single-season sack record. Harris - we have a noticeable drop-off @ MLB when he is subbed out of the game. Q Floyd - has trended upward this whole season (& looks to be doing so somewhat injured)
HS Players: Harvey - started most season & has had valuable PT as RS-Fr. Peavy - probably our best DB at body-positioning & another RS-Fr. Lazard, Warren & Josh Thomas - nothing really needs said. Wesley has flashed. Epps @ WR seen the field as true FR. Mills @ LB has flashed more the past couples games (he's listed ahead of Harvey this week @ WLB). There are a lot of players who should only get better. However, this has been said before & development has lacked. Combined with debacles like not knowing what down it is and there you have it.
We add a couple solid additions to the D (1 on DL, 1 @ DB & maybe 1 @ LB) & replace our OL sufficiently, we should be set up pretty well compared to the past several years. Key is 'should', as in the coaches should now what freaking down it is.
That is entirely on the staff - yet, the comments made after the game kind of place the blame on the players (wow) & I have a difficult time wanting to give the leader of this group 1 more shot.
Then, we have added a lot more talent in the past 2 years & do not want to break up the group responsible for that if they can replicate it for next year. JC PLAYERS: Demond Tucker - leader of the D there. He played more snaps as players behind him are injured (Aka, I believe) - but look what he did playing more snaps. Maybe our 1's need to play a little bit more, tired or not. Jay Jones - playmaker. Jhaustin Thomas - flashes (been injured twice by opposing linemen cut-blocking right at his knees). Wiltz - probably our best DB at actually playing the ball. Philbert - JC coming in with 3 years to play & gets in the rotation. Pierson - like D Tucker played more snaps as we've had our depth depleted & he produced big-time Saturday & is on the verge of breaking the single-season sack record. Harris - we have a noticeable drop-off @ MLB when he is subbed out of the game. Q Floyd - has trended upward this whole season (& looks to be doing so somewhat injured)
HS Players: Harvey - started most season & has had valuable PT as RS-Fr. Peavy - probably our best DB at body-positioning & another RS-Fr. Lazard, Warren & Josh Thomas - nothing really needs said. Wesley has flashed. Epps @ WR seen the field as true FR. Mills @ LB has flashed more the past couples games (he's listed ahead of Harvey this week @ WLB). There are a lot of players who should only get better. However, this has been said before & development has lacked. Combined with debacles like not knowing what down it is and there you have it.
We add a couple solid additions to the D (1 on DL, 1 @ DB & maybe 1 @ LB) & replace our OL sufficiently, we should be set up pretty well compared to the past several years. Key is 'should', as in the coaches should now what freaking down it is.
It's not so much that they didn't know what down it was that bothers me. It's that they had a timeout and refused to use it. Instead we allow OKST to load the box and 50k people know we're running the ball and where. It comes down to coaching, this isn't the YSF league.