Refs Protect Players

[JJ4ISU]

Why do referees feel the need to protect the big name players in the Big 12? In the game yesterday, that gray-haired referee called a foul on ISU just about every time Durant had the ball. Same thing down at A&M; every time Joseph Jones touched the ball down low-automatic foul. I think our big guys are playing solid straight-up defense-as good as can be without fouling, and yet they get whistled. I felt sorry for Hubalek, Clark and the others trying to guard these guys. What else can they do?

Also, I think this hurts teams during the NCAA tournament. Teams like KU, A&M and Texas won't get these calls during tournament time.

 

[ISUKyro]

I have always wondered that myself. I also wondered if it wasn't just because those were the players that I was watching, so anytime anything was called around them I took notice where as any other foul on somebody I didn't know I just dismissed.
Not sure if that made sense or not.

 

[avery_larry]

Why do referees feel the need to protect the big name players in the Big 12? In the game yesterday, that gray-haired referee called a foul on ISU just about every time Durant had the ball. Same thing down at A&M; every time Joseph Jones touched the ball down low-automatic foul. I think our big guys are playing solid straight-up defense-as good as can be without fouling, and yet they get whistled. I felt sorry for Hubalek, Clark and the others trying to guard these guys. What else can they do?

Also, I think this hurts teams during the NCAA tournament. Teams like KU, A&M and Texas won't get these calls during tournament time.

Oh c'mon. You're just being a homer. :rolleyes5cz: Durant's a great player and when a good player guards a great player--foul time. When a great player guards a good player, they're good enough not to foul. When a great player finally (in the tourney) has to guard another great player, then fouls start to happen. I know some refs personally and they are doing their best to be unbiased. What amazed me was that Ceaser didn't get many fouls.

 

[JJ4ISU]

Avery- I am not being a homer...when Fizer and Tinsley played, we got a LOT of calls. Tinsley, in particular, got bailed out a lot in 2000-01. Watch the replay of the A&M game; Joseph Jones had Hubalek posted up; Jones turned around and got his shot blocked by the bottom of the backboard; he fell down and hurt his knee--foul on Hubalek...ridiculous!

 

[dbronco7sc]

I know I'm not trained to be a ref... so I could be completely wrong... but I was glad to see other people thought this too. It seemed right away early in the Texas game... we had guys with feet planted... arms straight up and not moving... and durant would have his back to our guy and shoot a turn around jumper (while jumping forward into our guys) and we'd get called on a foul. All that does is encourage defenders to run away when a guy is coming at you so you don't get a foul. And I only really noticed it with Durant in the first half... I think they called a foul on him or two in the second half.

But I don't know how many times we had guys who's hands were slapped knocking the ball out for a steal... No foul... Durant reached completely around a guy and slapped the ball out (didn't get a clear view of it) but those normally seem to be a foul that would have been a foul. When guys are coming down with rebounds Texas was would some how knock it free when we've got two solid hands on it. And the worst.. I believe was Durant... blocked from behind an open drive to the hoop by Gray (I think) and the block occured before the ball left Gray's hands and it was a two handed layup... how Durant could have gotten to the ball without going through both of Gray's hands is beyond me... but there was no foul.

No doubt that Durant is a great player... but from what I saw on TV against ISU... he seemed to get a lot of help from Refs with fouls called against our defenders...

And I have a lot of respect for refs... but with big name players getting everything they do shown on TV by the media... I wonder if a ref fears making a wrong call involving such a player knowing it will get big media hype... and thus make more calls in their favor.

 

[wonkadog]

The 3-point play Durant had against Wesley in the 1st half was a complete joke. He got the ball, pivoted, and shot a bank shot that went right in while Johnson stood behind him. Foul on Wesley. I was so sick of hearing Durant's name by halftime.

 

[cmoore_23]

ya i didnt agree on alot of the calls, and the refs didnt call anything on texas that they were calling on us.. and when they did call a foul on durant on the lob they didnt let westley shoot the free throws, what was up with that, i think gmac should of doen his best to get a T on that 1 just because it is pathetic the way the ref called it, because he even waited to see if westleymade the shot b4 he called it... just plain dumb on the refs part..
but it was funny how ceasor was shutting durant down, and he was getting frusterated, and with that said, did u see some of the elbows and the puch durant was doing against us? prob should have been a couple of offensive fouls on him..but owell, games over..

 

[CyCloned]

Why do referees feel the need to protect the big name players in the Big 12?

I don't know why refs do this, but anyone that saw the ISU vs TX game saw at least 3 absolute horrible calls against ISU guys guarding Durant. You could see Clark was getting frustrated with the refs. On the flip side, whatever Ceaser(sp) was doing was working on Durant and he was not getting called.

 

[clones_jer]

Why do referees feel the need to protect the big name players in the Big 12?

I don't know why refs do this, but anyone that saw the ISU vs TX game saw at least 3 absolute horrible calls against ISU guys guarding Durant. You could see Clark was getting frustrated with the refs. On the flip side, whatever Ceaser(sp) was doing was working on Durant and he was not getting called.

Probably because Clark was fouling him and Ceaser was not.

Comeon guys, enough with the conspircy theories ... Durant is tall, quick and has deadly range - the perfect storm against defenders. College officials work 3-man crews which allow them to be much closer to the play than you and me. Who should we believe, a coach raising his arms in frustration at a call 30 ft or more from him, or the ref standing 5 ft away? I'll accomidate the "Jordan rules" because the NBA is much more "entertainment" based, but college officials are just calling the plays as they happen per the book.

 

[Wesley]

Ceasar had Durant's number at only 17 - first time under 30 points in Big 12. Ceasar for Player of the Week. May be last time we have to play Durant ever.

 

[Michael Lastuvka]

Probably because Clark was fouling him and Ceaser was not.

Comeon guys, enough with the conspircy theories ... Durant is tall, quick and has deadly range - the perfect storm against defenders. College officials work 3-man crews which allow them to be much closer to the play than you and me. Who should we believe, a coach raising his arms in frustration at a call 30 ft or more from him, or the ref standing 5 ft away?

Good call. I actually thought a few times that Caesar was heavily leaning on Durant and nothing was called.

 

[jparker22]

Probably because Clark was fouling him and Ceaser was not.

Comeon guys, enough with the conspircy theories ... Durant is tall, quick and has deadly range - the perfect storm against defenders. College officials work 3-man crews which allow them to be much closer to the play than you and me. Who should we believe, a coach raising his arms in frustration at a call 30 ft or more from him, or the ref standing 5 ft away? I'll accomidate the "Jordan rules" because the NBA is much more "entertainment" based, but college officials are just calling the plays as they happen per the book.

I would not say the calls changed the outcome game but I do have to disagree with your opinion that the "Jordan Rules" were not in effect during the game. I don't think it is a conspiracy theory but the kid is getting the benefit of the doubt too often for a freshman. Clark should have been getting the benefit, and Ceaser did not get many called on him b/c he did a better job of denying the ball. Durant had a little favortism from the crew at the game, I would think that there should have been at least one call on him when he was reaching for steals especially on the second steal from Taylor. Again, I don't think it changed the outcome but I do think he is garnering too much respect as a freshman. funny you reference the "Jordan Rules" though since that was the exact phrase used by my buddy during the game.

 

[mj4cy]

It also seems that when a big name player has 3 fouls and that player along with a teammate both foul someone, they NEVER pick the big name.....that way he can play more

 

[clones_jer]

I would not say the calls changed the outcome game but I do have to disagree with your opinion that the "Jordan Rules" were not in effect during the game. I don't think it is a conspiracy theory but the kid is getting the benefit of the doubt too often for a freshman. Clark should have been getting the benefit, and Ceaser did not get many called on him b/c he did a better job of denying the ball. Durant had a little favortism from the crew at the game, I would think that there should have been at least one call on him when he was reaching for steals especially on the second steal from Taylor. Again, I don't think it changed the outcome but I do think he is garnering too much respect as a freshman. funny you reference the "Jordan Rules" though since that was the exact phrase used by my buddy during the game.

it's just a common theme amongst all of the fans of "other" teams - the Bulls fans would never admit to it:biggrin9gp:

I think fans see their our own players through rose-colored glasses most of the time. for example, Mizzou plays a full court press the entire game and get pissed when their team is called for more team fouls ... or Clark is a half a step slow (as imho he has been this year) against a very quick opponent and we get upset when he gets in foul trouble.

I've said this before but it bears repeating: No one ever says "the refs really won that game for us" Win despite calls, don't whine about them.

 

[mkadl]

Does anyone know if games are assigned to specific refs before the season? Or do they put the best refs on nationally televised, specific rivalry games, and games involving league leaders when they play each other, as fits the occasion. This has been my suspicion for years.

 

[clones_jer]

Though I do not have specific knowledge of the Big 12 - most officials are assigned before the season to provide of travel and scheduling considerations.

 

[wonkadog]

it's just a common theme amongst all of the fans of "other" teams - the Bulls fans would never admit to it:biggrin9gp:

I think fans see their our own players through rose-colored glasses most of the time. for example, Mizzou plays a full court press the entire game and get pissed when their team is called for more team fouls ... or Clark is a half a step slow (as imho he has been this year) against a very quick opponent and we get upset when he gets in foul trouble.

I've said this before but it bears repeating: No one ever says "the refs really won that game for us" Win despite calls, don't whine about them.

I'll be the first to admit that the refs won us that game at Missouri earlier. Not that I'm saying that they made the wrong call and it went in our favor, however they didn't call the foul that usually gets called on the trap in the corner and that worked to our benefit. I can tell that you are probably involved in officiating or something and I officiate also. However, I'm not going to go as far as you do in defending the calls. Go back and take a look at some of those "fouls" that went in Durant's favor and tell us that Ceasar gets those same calls in those exact situations. :rolleyes5cz:

 

[clones_jer]

Seriously the refs won us the Mizzou game?!?! You really want to say that?

I thought Mizzou fans were just a bunch of whiners and we deserved that win - at least that's what I've been reading.

As for my take on it, I'll let the guy standing 2 ft away that is a Big 12 official make the call.

Edit:
Here's your take on the call the day after it happened to refresh your memory:

"I was happy to see my buddy Tom O'Neill call travelling on that last play. It looked like the correct call to me (I saw the defender body up the player and nudge the ball but not actually push the player holding the ball)." - wonkadog

 

[ISUFan22]

I've said this before but it bears repeating: No one ever says "the refs really won that game for us"

If the '05/'06 Steelers didn't send the refs from that Super Bowl a thank you card after that game - they probably didn't send any thank you cards for their past wedding presents.

Seriously, there were some down-right bad calls in that game that nearly gift-wrapped the thing for Pittsburgh.

But anyways - generally I get sick of hearing non-stop complaints about officials. It just gets old. Especially when we're getting our butts handed to us and fans gripe about the officials.

 

[wonkadog]

Seriously the refs won us the Mizzou game?!?! You really want to say that?

I thought Mizzou fans were just a bunch of whiners and we deserved that win - at least that's what I've been reading.

As for my take on it, I'll let the guy standing 2 ft away that is a Big 12 official make the call.

Edit:
Here's your take on the call the day after it happened to refresh your memory:

"I was happy to see my buddy Tom O'Neill call travelling on that last play. It looked like the correct call to me (I saw the defender body up the player and nudge the ball but not actually push the player holding the ball)." - wonkadog

I didn't say the refs won us the game at Mizzou but they helped us by not making that call. I can tell that you're best friends with all the officials in college basketball or something and are unbelievably touchy about anyone hinting that they might make a wrong call now and then so that's ok. I'll side with the other 90% of the people posting in this thread that think there might have been some preferential treatment given to Durant, purposefully or not. Not trying to start a big fight, just stating my opinion and I also respect yours.