Comparing Iowa and ISU Recruiting--The Matchups

Aclone

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Dec 14, 2007
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I thought that, given how much attention is given to "stars", I'd take a look at how actual physical talent matches up between our class, and one more highly rated in Iowa City. I pick the matchups, you draw your own conclusions--as if I had to tell anyone here that anyway. :biggrin:

It is said that the true excitement of build a team begins on both sides of the trenches. With that in mind, let’s start off with a peek at the respective line recruits…and yes, I admit that I played around a bit in an effort to make some more intriguing matchups.

By the way--I was startled at some of the similarities.

Dan Burton OL 6’4†275 vs Mitch Keppy OL 6’5 280

Let’s start off with a decent matchup. Big school class president, versatile lineman versus Hawkeye legacy from a small school. Athletically, not much stands out to tell apart. Edge: Even

Jake Dunning 6’5†275 vs Ryan Ward 6’5†275

This one’s kinda humorous. One of these players is from a relatively new program in a burgeoning city, the other is from a traditional powerhouse that recruiters make a habitual stop. One has been playing football for two years, the other all his life. Other than that, they may well prove to be virtually the same player. Edge: Iowa

Duaron Williams OG 6’4†290 vs Jaleel Johnson DT 6’4†300

Boom! These two big guys are a natural matchup—because they’ll likely be battling each other the next few years. And here we go again. Both elite athletes, same size, and they’ll be going head to head on more than paper. The only real difference? One knee surgery. Edge: Iowa

Pierre Aka DE 6’2†255 vs Faith Ekakitie DL 6’2†255

Yep, another case where these two could almost be the same player. Same general size, same athleticism, one has better experience, polish and exposure than the other. We’ll see how long that lasts. Still, conventional wisdom says one player wins. Edge: Iowa.

Collin Bevins DL 6’5†250 vs Drew Ott 6’4†245

These two are also similar in a lot of ways. Each staff is excited about their sleeper defensive lineman—though I’m still not quite sure why, in one case. Still, to be fair, I’ll call it a draw. The difference isn’t that much. Yet. Edge: Even.

Mitchell Meyers DL 6’4†255 vs D. Venckus-Cucchiara DL 6’5†230

Hey, this one works for me. Neither is highly recruited, yet ISU coaches consider their player a physical phenom, UI coaches theirs a beast. Perfect. Edge: Even

Devlyn Cousin DT 6’2†280 vs Reid Sealby 6’4†250


Once I swapped linemen around for better matchups, that left this pairing. Much better, since Sealby doesn’t really seem to compare to Burton, or Cousin to Johnson. Not close in either case. Cousin is squatty, but has a quick step when he releases from the blocker. Sealby is about as “sleeper†as sleepers get. Edge: Even

Corey Morrissey DE 6’4†240 vs Eric Simmons C 6’2†295


Just as simple to take the two former teammates that their respective coaches are equally excited about, with equal amounts of eligibility—and let them cancel each other out. Edge: Even

Clifford Stokes CB 6’0†180 vs Cody Sokol QB 6’2†215


Ditto. These two will be long gone before some of their signing mates are ready for the field. Edge: Even

Grant Rohach QB 6’2†185 vs C.J. Beathard QB 6’2†180

Seriously. Anyone wanna match up these two any more closely? Only time will tell. Edge: Even

T.J. Mutcherson DB 5’10†190 vs Ruben Lile DB 6’3†200


The similarity here is that both were two-way players who will likely be safeties. Both are very good athletes. Edge: Even

Charlie Rogers CB 6’1†193 vs Maurice Fleming CB 6’0†185


The matchups among the defensive backs were a little more difficult. Here I wound up taking what appeared to be each school’s best corner and pairing them. Guess what? Edge: Even

Damian Lawry CB 6’0†165 vs Sean Draper CB 6’0†165

I could have stuck Buford here, but the similarity in size was just too tempting, From that start, it will be interesting to see how each respective player matures through their career. Edge: Even

Luke Knott S 6’1†190 vs Anthony (Morgan) Gair DB 6’2†195


Another tough choice, since Gair might well have paired with Rogers. Still, a matchup of the cerebral leader Knott, and a player who might be slightly faster and more athletic. I suppose it depends on what you are looking for. Feel free to argue, but: Edge: Even

Adam Pavlenko LB 5’10†210 vs Laron Taylor LB 6’0†210

A matchup between two undersized linebackers who don’t have blazing speed. Sorry, I have to call this one a draw. Edge: Even

Kane Seeley LB 6’1†215 vs Nate Meier ATH 6’2†235

Shoot, Meier might well compare to Jevohn Miller. In any case, this one is yet another draw, between good athletes with their future ahead of them. Edge: Even

Darius White MLB 6’1†235 vs Greg Garmon RB 6’1†200


This is where I got the idea of across-the-line-of-scrimmage matchups. After all, this might be the first time these two meet head to head, but it’ll be far from the last. Cyclone coaches want to groom White as the future Mike linebacker, Garmon may be the Hawk starter when camp starts—and he likes to run up the middle. Edge: Iowa

Quan West WR 6’4†208 vs Cameron Wilson WR 6’1†195

The matchups here at wideout were as tough as with the defensive backs. In this case, I ended up going with “highest rated vs one anotherâ€. Styles completely different, West is a physical receiver (perhaps Krieger-Kittle would have been a more comparable matchup) more like McNutt, Wilson may be another DJK. In a cowardly manner, resorting strictly to rankings: Edge: Slight to ISU.

P.J. Harris WR 6’1†160 vs Greg Mabin 6’2†190

No, I didn’t pick them out of a hat. In this case, I went with two small school Florida players who both run well. Still, feel free to mix ‘em up any other way, if you want to. Slight Edge: ISU

Dondre Daley WR 6’3†170 vs Tevaun Smith WR 6’2†190

In this case, I tried to go with the most athletic of the respective groups. It might be a secret to some, but I think that Daley will mature into a tremendous player. I also expect Smith and Wilson will be on the field early in their careers for Iowa. Edge: ISU

Cole Netten PK 6’1†205 vs Connor Kornbrath P 6’6†208

Sure, call the two specialists a draw as well. Check back in a couple of years. Edge: Even

Strays: Iowa is left with Kevin Buford, Barkley Hill and George Krieger-Kittle all unpaired. I like Buford, I think he compares well to Kenneth Lynn from a class ago. They also may still sign a highly touted guard from Colorado. The latter pair? Well, fine. I’m pretty sure that Iowa was winning this matchup already anyway, irrespective of numbers. That doesn’t mean that CPR isn’t catching up quickly.
 
Put a reminder on your calendar to check back on this thread in about 3 years.
 
earths gonna end this year, so it seems pointless to put a reminder in your phone.
 
Williams and Aka might be the best two in this class and you give the edge to Iowa on both. Not a fan.
Honestly? They are about as even as it is possible to be. But Aka played little defense his senior year, and Williams didn't play at all. So you know what? Experience--and proven results--have to give an edge somewhere.

Of course, if I were certain either of Aka's listed 4.69 40 time, or Ekakitie's listed 5.06, Aka could have had the edge right there. Time will tell.
 
I know that a person could probably quibble with any of your match-ups and analysis. But come on, Jacob Dunning and Ryan Ward --- virtually the same player ? Go back and look and the videos of those two. Ryan Ward is (maybe) a road grader. Way too slow to be an offensive tackle at the college level. Sure doesn't show the kind of footwork that is going to keep a quick DE from the QB. Jacob Dunning is an OT all the way. Athletic, fast on his feet. Videos demonstrated that he could easily keep speed rushers out of the backfield (He played against a lot of speed guys in Texas). Heck, look like they pulled him on nearly every running play that went to the opposite side.

Don't get me wrong. Ryan Ward may become a great college guard. But these two are not virtually the same player......(IMO).
 
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Don't get me wrong. Ryan Ward may become a great college guard. But these two are not virtually the same player......(IMO).
To tell you the truth, I didn't want to look like a Cyclone homer by saying that a player who was barely noticed in recruiting circles was better than one was better than one who was a four-star, and rated in the top 20 at his position...so I'm glad that you did! :cool:
 
Williams and Aka might be the best two in this class and you give the edge to Iowa on both. Not a fan.

Williams = 3* and #52 at his position.
Aka = 3* and #117 at his position.

Ekatitie = 4* and #13 at his position.
Johnson = 4* and #20 at his position.

As flawed as stars and rankings can be, it's all there is to go by at this point. It's pretty clear.
 
Williams = 3* and #52 at his position.
Aka = 3* and #117 at his position.

Ekatitie = 4* and #13 at his position.
Johnson = 4* and #20 at his position.

As flawed as stars and rankings can be, it's all there is to go by at this point. It's pretty clear.
This picture is Williams owning 5 star DT Aziz Shittu #3 at his position. I'm not saying, I'm just saying. I'm not saying he's better, there's alot of things that go into rankings and for the most part I think they are a pretty accurate judge of athleticism. But at the same time they're crap, and can't take into account how smart, or how hard a player will work, or how a player will grow.
 
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Holy waste of time. Does everything have to be measured vis-a-vis the hawks?
 
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Holy waste of time. Does everything have to be measured vis-a-vis the hawks?

Well if you want to measure up against another team out of curiosity, the other team in the same state seems to be a good, logical choice.
 
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All you have to do is listen to where the starters in the Super Bowl went to college. There is a lot of talent out there that gets overlooked by the big boys. With that said, both Iowa and ISU's classes could suprise a few people 2-3 years from now.

Both our programs are about developing players and allowing player to grow their first couple years (In most cases. I know there are always a small percentage that hit the ground running as freshmen but not compared to the likes of OU, UT, OSU, Alabama, etc.)
 
Well if you want to measure up against another team out of curiosity, the other team in the same state seems to be a good, logical choice.

Exactly. He wanted to do it, he had fun doing it....I see no reason to call this a waste of time.

I say good work and let's make a note to come back to this thread periodically to see how they turn out!
 
I thought that, given how much attention is given to "stars", I'd take a look at how actual physical talent matches up between our class, and one more highly rated in Iowa City. I pick the matchups, you draw your own conclusions--as if I had to tell anyone here that anyway. :biggrin:

It is said that the true excitement of build a team begins on both sides of the trenches. With that in mind, let’s start off with a peek at the respective line recruits…and yes, I admit that I played around a bit in an effort to make some more intriguing matchups.

By the way--I was startled at some of the similarities.

Dan Burton OL 6’4†275 vs Mitch Keppy OL 6’5 280

Let’s start off with a decent matchup. Big school class president, versatile lineman versus Hawkeye legacy from a small school. Athletically, not much stands out to tell apart. Edge: Even

Jake Dunning 6’5†275 vs Ryan Ward 6’5†275

This one’s kinda humorous. One of these players is from a relatively new program in a burgeoning city, the other is from a traditional powerhouse that recruiters make a habitual stop. One has been playing football for two years, the other all his life. Other than that, they may well prove to be virtually the same player. Edge: Iowa

Duaron Williams OG 6’4†290 vs Jaleel Johnson DT 6’4†300

Boom! These two big guys are a natural matchup—because they’ll likely be battling each other the next few years. And here we go again. Both elite athletes, same size, and they’ll be going head to head on more than paper. The only real difference? One knee surgery. Edge: Iowa

Pierre Aka DE 6’2†255 vs Faith Ekakitie DL 6’2†255

Yep, another case where these two could almost be the same player. Same general size, same athleticism, one has better experience, polish and exposure than the other. We’ll see how long that lasts. Still, conventional wisdom says one player wins. Edge: Iowa.

Collin Bevins DL 6’5†250 vs Drew Ott 6’4†245

These two are also similar in a lot of ways. Each staff is excited about their sleeper defensive lineman—though I’m still not quite sure why, in one case. Still, to be fair, I’ll call it a draw. The difference isn’t that much. Yet. Edge: Even.

Mitchell Meyers DL 6’4†255 vs D. Venckus-Cucchiara DL 6’5†230

Hey, this one works for me. Neither is highly recruited, yet ISU coaches consider their player a physical phenom, UI coaches theirs a beast. Perfect. Edge: Even

Devlyn Cousin DT 6’2†280 vs Reid Sealby 6’4†250


Once I swapped linemen around for better matchups, that left this pairing. Much better, since Sealby doesn’t really seem to compare to Burton, or Cousin to Johnson. Not close in either case. Cousin is squatty, but has a quick step when he releases from the blocker. Sealby is about as “sleeper†as sleepers get. Edge: Even

Corey Morrissey DE 6’4†240 vs Eric Simmons C 6’2†295


Just as simple to take the two former teammates that their respective coaches are equally excited about, with equal amounts of eligibility—and let them cancel each other out. Edge: Even

Clifford Stokes CB 6’0†180 vs Cody Sokol QB 6’2†215


Ditto. These two will be long gone before some of their signing mates are ready for the field. Edge: Even

Grant Rohach QB 6’2†185 vs C.J. Beathard QB 6’2†180

Seriously. Anyone wanna match up these two any more closely? Only time will tell. Edge: Even

T.J. Mutcherson DB 5’10†190 vs Ruben Lile DB 6’3†200


The similarity here is that both were two-way players who will likely be safeties. Both are very good athletes. Edge: Even

Charlie Rogers CB 6’1†193 vs Maurice Fleming CB 6’0†185


The matchups among the defensive backs were a little more difficult. Here I wound up taking what appeared to be each school’s best corner and pairing them. Guess what? Edge: Even

Damian Lawry CB 6’0†165 vs Sean Draper CB 6’0†165

I could have stuck Buford here, but the similarity in size was just too tempting, From that start, it will be interesting to see how each respective player matures through their career. Edge: Even

Luke Knott S 6’1†190 vs Anthony (Morgan) Gair DB 6’2†195


Another tough choice, since Gair might well have paired with Rogers. Still, a matchup of the cerebral leader Knott, and a player who might be slightly faster and more athletic. I suppose it depends on what you are looking for. Feel free to argue, but: Edge: Even

Adam Pavlenko LB 5’10†210 vs Laron Taylor LB 6’0†210

A matchup between two undersized linebackers who don’t have blazing speed. Sorry, I have to call this one a draw. Edge: Even

Kane Seeley LB 6’1†215 vs Nate Meier ATH 6’2†235

Shoot, Meier might well compare to Jevohn Miller. In any case, this one is yet another draw, between good athletes with their future ahead of them. Edge: Even

Darius White MLB 6’1†235 vs Greg Garmon RB 6’1†200


This is where I got the idea of across-the-line-of-scrimmage matchups. After all, this might be the first time these two meet head to head, but it’ll be far from the last. Cyclone coaches want to groom White as the future Mike linebacker, Garmon may be the Hawk starter when camp starts—and he likes to run up the middle. Edge: Iowa

Quan West WR 6’4†208 vs Cameron Wilson WR 6’1†195

The matchups here at wideout were as tough as with the defensive backs. In this case, I ended up going with “highest rated vs one anotherâ€. Styles completely different, West is a physical receiver (perhaps Krieger-Kittle would have been a more comparable matchup) more like McNutt, Wilson may be another DJK. In a cowardly manner, resorting strictly to rankings: Edge: Slight to ISU.

P.J. Harris WR 6’1†160 vs Greg Mabin 6’2†190

No, I didn’t pick them out of a hat. In this case, I went with two small school Florida players who both run well. Still, feel free to mix ‘em up any other way, if you want to. Slight Edge: ISU

Dondre Daley WR 6’3†170 vs Tevaun Smith WR 6’2†190

In this case, I tried to go with the most athletic of the respective groups. It might be a secret to some, but I think that Daley will mature into a tremendous player. I also expect Smith and Wilson will be on the field early in their careers for Iowa. Edge: ISU

Cole Netten PK 6’1†205 vs Connor Kornbrath P 6’6†208

Sure, call the two specialists a draw as well. Check back in a couple of years. Edge: Even

Strays: Iowa is left with Kevin Buford, Barkley Hill and George Krieger-Kittle all unpaired. I like Buford, I think he compares well to Kenneth Lynn from a class ago. They also may still sign a highly touted guard from Colorado. The latter pair? Well, fine. I’m pretty sure that Iowa was winning this matchup already anyway, irrespective of numbers. That doesn’t mean that CPR isn’t catching up quickly.


There's nothing of any substance in any of your analysis. You basically just said that everyone is even to a prospect on the opposite team, regardless of what countless scouts and recruiters have determined.
 
This picture is Williams owning 5 star DT Aziz Shittu #3 at his position. I'm not saying, I'm just saying. I'm not saying he's better, there's alot of things that go into rankings and for the most part I think they are a pretty accurate judge of athleticism. But at the same time they're crap, and can't take into account how smart, or how hard a player will work, or how a player will grow.

Totally agree. It's what they do on the field, and the intangibles are a huge part of that. Williams could turn out to be the better player in the end.
 
Collin Bevins DL 6’5†250 vs Drew Ott 6’4†245

Edge: Even

T.J. Mutcherson DB 5’10†190 vs Ruben Lile DB 6’3†200

Edge: Even

Charlie Rogers CB 6’1†193 vs Maurice Fleming CB 6’0†185

Edge: Even

Luke Knott S 6’1†190 vs Anthony (Morgan) Gair DB 6’2†195

Edge: Even

Quan West WR 6’4†208 vs Cameron Wilson WR 6’1†195

Edge: Slight to ISU

I disagree with the ones above. Unless you've seen both players in high school, which I doubt, about the only thing you can go off of is offer sheets and rankings, and the Hawkeye recruits beat out the ISU recruits in both.
 
I thought that, given how much attention is given to "stars", I'd take a look at how actual physical talent matches up between our class, and one more highly rated in Iowa City. I pick the matchups, you draw your own conclusions--as if I had to tell anyone here that anyway. :biggrin:

It is said that the true excitement of build a team begins on both sides of the trenches. With that in mind, let’s start off with a peek at the respective line recruits…and yes, I admit that I played around a bit in an effort to make some more intriguing matchups.

By the way--I was startled at some of the similarities.

Dan Burton OL 6’4” 275 vs Mitch Keppy OL 6’5 280

Let’s start off with a decent matchup. Big school class president, versatile lineman versus Hawkeye legacy from a small school. Athletically, not much stands out to tell apart. Edge: Even

Jake Dunning 6’5” 275 vs Ryan Ward 6’5” 275

This one’s kinda humorous. One of these players is from a relatively new program in a burgeoning city, the other is from a traditional powerhouse that recruiters make a habitual stop. One has been playing football for two years, the other all his life. Other than that, they may well prove to be virtually the same player. Edge: Iowa

Duaron Williams OG 6’4” 290 vs Jaleel Johnson DT 6’4” 300

Boom! These two big guys are a natural matchup—because they’ll likely be battling each other the next few years. And here we go again. Both elite athletes, same size, and they’ll be going head to head on more than paper. The only real difference? One knee surgery. Edge: Iowa

Pierre Aka DE 6’2” 255 vs Faith Ekakitie DL 6’2” 255

Yep, another case where these two could almost be the same player. Same general size, same athleticism, one has better experience, polish and exposure than the other. We’ll see how long that lasts. Still, conventional wisdom says one player wins. Edge: Iowa.

Collin Bevins DL 6’5” 250 vs Drew Ott 6’4” 245

These two are also similar in a lot of ways. Each staff is excited about their sleeper defensive lineman—though I’m still not quite sure why, in one case. Still, to be fair, I’ll call it a draw. The difference isn’t that much. Yet. Edge: Even.

Mitchell Meyers DL 6’4” 255 vs D. Venckus-Cucchiara DL 6’5” 230

Hey, this one works for me. Neither is highly recruited, yet ISU coaches consider their player a physical phenom, UI coaches theirs a beast. Perfect. Edge: Even

Devlyn Cousin DT 6’2” 280 vs Reid Sealby 6’4” 250

Once I swapped linemen around for better matchups, that left this pairing. Much better, since Sealby doesn’t really seem to compare to Burton, or Cousin to Johnson. Not close in either case. Cousin is squatty, but has a quick step when he releases from the blocker. Sealby is about as “sleeper” as sleepers get. Edge: Even

Corey Morrissey DE 6’4” 240 vs Eric Simmons C 6’2” 295

Just as simple to take the two former teammates that their respective coaches are equally excited about, with equal amounts of eligibility—and let them cancel each other out. Edge: Even

Clifford Stokes CB 6’0” 180 vs Cody Sokol QB 6’2” 215

Ditto. These two will be long gone before some of their signing mates are ready for the field. Edge: Even

Grant Rohach QB 6’2” 185 vs C.J. Beathard QB 6’2” 180

Seriously. Anyone wanna match up these two any more closely? Only time will tell. Edge: Even

T.J. Mutcherson DB 5’10” 190 vs Ruben Lile DB 6’3” 200

The similarity here is that both were two-way players who will likely be safeties. Both are very good athletes. Edge: Even

Charlie Rogers CB 6’1” 193 vs Maurice Fleming CB 6’0” 185

The matchups among the defensive backs were a little more difficult. Here I wound up taking what appeared to be each school’s best corner and pairing them. Guess what? Edge: Even

Damian Lawry CB 6’0” 165 vs Sean Draper CB 6’0” 165

I could have stuck Buford here, but the similarity in size was just too tempting, From that start, it will be interesting to see how each respective player matures through their career. Edge: Even

Luke Knott S 6’1” 190 vs Anthony (Morgan) Gair DB 6’2” 195

Another tough choice, since Gair might well have paired with Rogers. Still, a matchup of the cerebral leader Knott, and a player who might be slightly faster and more athletic. I suppose it depends on what you are looking for. Feel free to argue, but: Edge: Even

Adam Pavlenko LB 5’10” 210 vs Laron Taylor LB 6’0” 210

A matchup between two undersized linebackers who don’t have blazing speed. Sorry, I have to call this one a draw. Edge: Even

Kane Seeley LB 6’1” 215 vs Nate Meier ATH 6’2” 235

Shoot, Meier might well compare to Jevohn Miller. In any case, this one is yet another draw, between good athletes with their future ahead of them. Edge: Even

Darius White MLB 6’1” 235 vs Greg Garmon RB 6’1” 200

This is where I got the idea of across-the-line-of-scrimmage matchups. After all, this might be the first time these two meet head to head, but it’ll be far from the last. Cyclone coaches want to groom White as the future Mike linebacker, Garmon may be the Hawk starter when camp starts—and he likes to run up the middle. Edge: Iowa

Quan West WR 6’4” 208 vs Cameron Wilson WR 6’1” 195

The matchups here at wideout were as tough as with the defensive backs. In this case, I ended up going with “highest rated vs one another”. Styles completely different, West is a physical receiver (perhaps Krieger-Kittle would have been a more comparable matchup) more like McNutt, Wilson may be another DJK. In a cowardly manner, resorting strictly to rankings: Edge: Slight to ISU.

P.J. Harris WR 6’1” 160 vs Greg Mabin 6’2” 190

No, I didn’t pick them out of a hat. In this case, I went with two small school Florida players who both run well. Still, feel free to mix ‘em up any other way, if you want to. Slight Edge: ISU

Dondre Daley WR 6’3” 170 vs Tevaun Smith WR 6’2” 190

In this case, I tried to go with the most athletic of the respective groups. It might be a secret to some, but I think that Daley will mature into a tremendous player. I also expect Smith and Wilson will be on the field early in their careers for Iowa. Edge: ISU

Cole Netten PK 6’1” 205 vs Connor Kornbrath P 6’6” 208

Sure, call the two specialists a draw as well. Check back in a couple of years. Edge: Even

Strays: Iowa is left with Kevin Buford, Barkley Hill and George Krieger-Kittle all unpaired. I like Buford, I think he compares well to Kenneth Lynn from a class ago. They also may still sign a highly touted guard from Colorado. The latter pair? Well, fine. I’m pretty sure that Iowa was winning this matchup already anyway, irrespective of numbers. That doesn’t mean that CPR isn’t catching up quickly.
Don't take this the wrong way -- but who are you and why should I care what you think???? My analyses go to the bottom line and I have ISU kicking the hok's *** for at least 8 out of the next 10 years. And I admit I am nobody.
 

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