Hang their jerseys
- Thread starter Knownothing
- Start date
If Xavier Foster came on campus this year and had Melvin Ejim's exact senior year (team success too) before going to the NBA as an early-entrant, we'd all be claiming he should be the first one-and-done to get his jersey hung in the rafters.
Ejim is the shining example of what we'd hope for any athlete who comes to ISU... Gets on campus and contributes right away as a freshman, works his butt off, makes great strides in his on-court skills and ends his career as the Big 12 POTY. All while being a superb representative of the University academically.
Had he arrived on campus the same year as Morris and had the same level of overall team success as Monte did throughout his career, we'd be arguing if Ejim was the best Cyclone of all time.
Haliburton and THT also show that it's going to be rare to get 4 year guys who seem like legends on the national stage.
If Georges had his current body he wouldn't have been a 4 year player.
If Monte showed up 20 pounds heavier he wouldn't have been a 4 year player.
Ejim probably is that rare guy who just improved every year without a major physical transformation and ended up as one of the nation's best in year 4.
THT and Haliburton and Fizer all made a perfectly fine career choice to start life with millions of dollars doing what they love.
If Georges had his current body he wouldn't have been a 4 year player.
If Monte showed up 20 pounds heavier he wouldn't have been a 4 year player.
Ejim probably is that rare guy who just improved every year without a major physical transformation and ended up as one of the nation's best in year 4.
THT and Haliburton and Fizer all made a perfectly fine career choice to start life with millions of dollars doing what they love.
I 90% agree with this and great post...but I do think his game got polished year by year where Monte arrived fully polished and just grew/filled out a little.
Monte's dominance of the ISU (and Big 12 history) record book has something to do with his teams winning a lot...but he was a big part of that and there's a reason he dominated minutes on those winning teams.
I was looking at all time Big 12 records the other day. There's a strong statistical case that Monte Morris could be first team Big 12 for an all Big 12 historical team. He's freaking everywhere in the Big 12 record books.
Right... I don't mean to diminish what Monte did of course. He was great in his own way and I agree that he arrived more polished (though he did make strides in his own way by becoming more of an offensive focal point over time).
Monte also definitely benefitted from arriving when he did. Being a freshman on that Kane/Ejim/Hogue team was perfect for him.
As a Jr. he led the league in rebounding and was 3rd team all-conference and was the Conference's Scholar Athlete of the year.
He became only the 4th player in conference history with 1500 pts and 1000 rebounds. He finished his career as ISUs all time leader in games played, games started and games won.
Obviously Ejim made a big jump as a Sr., but he was a very good all-around player his entire career, certainly as a Jr. and Sr.
Fizer, Monte, and Niang are all obvious and I would put as 1a, 1b, and 1c. To me Ejim is above Tinsley. Tinsley was more talented, but I think overall impact is a factor and I think Ejim had a bigger impact. I also struggle a bit with the two year aspect. I still think Tinsley should go up there, but he is the lowest on there for me.
CycloneErik
Well-Known Member
Big 12 Player of the Year. All-American. Academic All-American.
It's frankly stupid to argue against Melvin Ejim.
The Big 12 PotY is a nice award and all, but honestly looking back, it's kind of a fluke. Ejim wasn't even "the guy" for us his Senior year. I recall a story after Niang got hurt that Fred had half his plays designed for Kane, half designed for Niang and had to throw the plays for Niang out. Ejim also had the 48 point game where everyone was just trying to get him as many points as possible which boosted his PPG quite a bit. Even just lower that game to 20 points and he's not our leading scorer that season.
Make fun of me for using this all you want, but forgive me for thinking that someone picked 7th in a Hoiberg era Cyclones draft by Cyclone fans should be considered to have their names up in the rafters. https://www.widerightnattylite.com/2015/6/29/8860189/the-wrnl-hoiberg-era-fantasy-draft
Ejim was a GREAT Cyclone. I won't be mad at all if he gets his jersey honored. But he's not on the same level as Morris and Niang, which is also evident by where all three of those guys are playing right now. (I realize this doesn't matter for what they did in college)
Ah here we go, someone has a different opinion than me, call them stupid! Love it.
2019-20: Azubuike, KU finished 1st
2018-19: Culver, Tech finished tied 1st
2017-18: Devonte Graham, KU finished 1st
2016-17: Frank Mason, KU finished 1st
2015-16: Buddy Hield, OU finished 3rd
2014-15: Buddy Hield, OU finished 3rd
I'd probably argue against Buddy Hield winning his first one too, but his 2015-16 season he averaged 25 PPG so tough to not give him that one. I loved Ejim and glad he won the award, but he was the 3rd best player on the tied for 3rd best team in the conference.
I'm not going to change your mind, I'll live with it
CycloneErik
Well-Known Member
In your other posts, you're arguing against your own evidence. It's ridiculous.
But, if you want to argue that we shouldn't put jerseys of players from KU, Tech, OU, or any other non-ISU school up in Hilton, we can agree.
For the record, I didn't call it stupid because you disagreed. It's stupid because the goalposts move on Melvin in this argument every single time. At some point, people just need to go with "Look, I don't want to," because that's what it is.
It should be a positive element for inclusion, but shouldn't be a requirement.
This is how I see it. If you have academic achievements like Ejim it should be a positive factor in the decision but simply graduating shouldn't be a requirement.
I don’t think consensus all American is a pre requisite. Not sure why I see people getting hung up on that.
I roll my eyes harder than anyone at the idea of P5/6 conference basketball and football being “amateur,” but I don’t mind requiring graduation to have a jersey hung. If it’s important to the player, they can finish the degree after their career is over. With online classes, I’m guessing most could probably finish necessary coursework without setting foot in Ames.
I'm all for getting an education, but a guy who is making multi-millions a year in his post college job really has nothing to prove. Morris signed for what in his initial 3 year contract? $4.66M? That's over 46 years in a $100,000 a year job. If he makes wise investments he could feasibly retire even if he never gets another NBA contract.
Maybe we should ensure that guys are getting meaningful degrees as well. No general studies or other athlete specials like that.
I have a buddy who left ISU after his junior year for a full time job that became a great career. He is making a hell of a lot more than I ever will even though he doesn't have his degree and was probably only a semester or so from earning the degree. There is no legitimate reason for him to finish his degree either.
CycloneErik
Well-Known Member
His new deal is 3 years, $27 million total. He can do fine for the rest of his days.
Great points....seems the old "parameters" Jamie has shared is of a different era. And it's tough because someone like Ejim i'd say while individually he was great, he contributed to a greater good of the team differently than someone who just gets a bunch of individual accolades. If i recall, the "graduation" thing is one of our requirements...which is nuts to think of a guy like Fizer that got the awards and was a top 5 pick. There also does seem to be a bit of emotional decision of the ones of the past...if Fred wasn't from Ames, would have he gotten the honor?