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This is why Prohm must go........

CloneIce said:
How in the world did you come to the conclusion that Hoiberg having a losing year in his first season at Nebraska has anything at all to do with assessing the job Prohm has done at ISU? It’s meaningless - grasping at straws to defend Prohms performance which is indefensible.

Edit - what in the world does Bruce Weber have to do with Tyreses development?
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Bruce weber was tyreses coach this summer on the USA u19 team. I imagine he has something to do with his development. He didn't shoot into the lottery because of summer workouts with prohm. He shot into the lottery because he was the leader of the u19 team that wasfull of future NBA players. Now if prohm is the sole reason he did well playing under Weber than so be it, but prohm and his staff aren't the only coaches tyrese has played for in the last year.

Isn't Bruce Weber a high experience coach who we aren't even supposed to compare prohm too? Isn't that what you said Cat, that it isn't fair to compare prohm to the other big 12 coaches like Huggins, Weber, and self?
 
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CloneIce said:
Basketball players are supposed to improve during their college career! That is a baseline expectation. You don’t get a gold star for that. Especially when there have been too many players who haven’t improved or were outright recruiting misses.

Your argument that a handful of players meeting a standard expectation of improvement over their careers means Prohm is great at player development is... baffling, to say the least.
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So guys that weren’t elite recruits turning into nba players doesn’t show coaching and development?

jesus.
 
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Cycl1 said:
Bruce weber was tyreses coach this summer on the USA u19 team. I imagine he has something to do with his development. He didn't shoot into the lottery because of summer workouts with prohm. He shot into the lottery because he was the leader of the u19 team that wasfull of future NBA players. Now if prohm is the sole reason he did well playing under Weber than so be it, but prohm and his staff aren't the only coaches tyrese has played for in the last year.

Isn't Bruce Weber a high experience coach who we aren't even supposed to compare prohm too? Isn't that what you said Cat, that it isn't fair to compare prohm to the other big 12 coaches like Huggins, Weber, and self?
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Another post of half truths and outright lies. I’m stunned.

Yep, Tyrese would be complete and total ******* if it weren’t for Bruce Weber.

think he thinks that?
 
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Cycl1 said:
Bruce weber was tyreses coach this summer on the USA u19 team. I imagine he has something to do with his development. He didn't shoot into the lottery because of summer workouts with prohm. He shot into the lottery because he was the leader of the u19 team that wasfull of future NBA players. Now if prohm is the sole reason he did well playing under Weber than so be it, but prohm and his staff aren't the only coaches tyrese has played for in the last year.

Isn't Bruce Weber a high experience coach who we aren't even supposed to compare prohm too? Isn't that what you said Cat, that it isn't fair to compare prohm to the other big 12 coaches like Huggins, Weber, and self?
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Ah got it now.
 
Cat Stevens said:
So guys that weren’t elite recruits turning into nba players doesn’t show coaching and development?

jesus.
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He has not shown me enough ability to consistently coach and develop his team, no. The results support my position. Player should improve! Coaches should develop players! You don’t get special credit because some specific players improved... that is a minimum baseline expectation.

Once again - when your primary argument for keeping Prohm is “Nader improved under him 5 years ago...”well that’s pretty telling.
 
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CloneIce said:
He has not shown me enough ability to consistently coach and develop his team, no. The results support my position. Player should improve! Coaches should develop players! You don’t get special credit because some specific players improved... that is a minimum baseline expectation.

Once again - when your primary argument for keeping Prohm is “Nader improved under him 5 years ago...”well that’s pretty telling.
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Or that there have been players since then of course that have earned nba paychecks like just this past year with shayock.

But please keep making things up. It’s what you guys do best.
 
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When your offense depends heavily on the 3 point shot, and you shoot 2-21 and other similar percentages throughout the year, you are going to be really bad.

At this point Prohm will be back, I am curious to see how the team does without one of the worst shooters in ISU history on the roster. I have stated time and again shooting is contagious, unfortunately Nixon was the equivalent of Corona Virus.

Probably a great kid, but he plays guard, guards need to at least make 1 out of 3 shots they take from 3, not 1 for every 6 and he might not have been that good.
 
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Cat Stevens said:
So guys that weren’t elite recruits turning into nba players doesn’t show coaching and development?

jesus.
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Prohm himself has said he never expected Tyrese to be as good as he is. He said that last year, that he came in and blew the staff away with how good he was from day 1. So no, he doesn’t get credit for Tyrese when Prohm himself has said that he came in day 1 and was this good. That’s straight from Prohms mouth, but keep making excuses for him when the coach himself makes you look stupid.

Edit: He gets major credit for finding Tyrese.
 
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Cat Stevens said:
Or that there have been players since then of course that have earned nba paychecks like just this past year with shayock.

But please keep making things up. It’s what you guys do best.
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I’m certainly not making this up. The results speak for themselves. He’s not shown that he can consistently coach and develop his team at the level needed to succeed in the Big 12 the way ISU fans deserve.
 
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Cat Stevens said:
Another post of half truths and outright lies. I’m stunned.

Yep, Tyrese would be complete and total ******* if it weren’t for Bruce Weber.

think he thinks that?
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Not at all.

Which part was a lie? Which part wasn't true? I'm going off memory here cause I'm not going to spend time looking for year old mock drafts,but this summer took him from end of the first round to the lottery in mock drafts. He spent the summer playing for Weber. Now maybe Weber just sat on his hands and didn't coach, or maybe nothing was learned by Tyrese, but you can't say one coach gets all the credit and the other gets none.
 
CloneIce said:
That pretty much sums it up. No need to lower expectations or make excuses. it’s time to move on to a coach that can succeed at the level ISU fans deserve.
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What level is that?

In my lifetime, ISU has had ONE legitimate squad, the 99-00 Fizer team. That is it.

Decent teams, top 25 teams, better than a lot of teams? Sure.

ku, Kentucky, Duke level teams? One and they made ISU's only real Elite 8.

I just don't know where these ideas of grandeur come from. This year has sucked and CSP is ultimately responsible. Has his record and have his accomplishments been on par with the highest levels of ISU basketball's history? Maybe. Did Fred have more success at ISU? Sure.

I don't really have a problem with everyone wanting to get rid of Prohm, my issue is with everyone's unrealistic and unfounded expectations for CSP and the ISU men's basketball program in general. (Kind of like football last year.)
 
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Macloney said:
What level is that?

In my lifetime, ISU has had ONE legitimate squad, the 99-00 Fizer team. That is it.

Decent teams, top 25 teams, better than a lot of teams? Sure.

ku, Kentucky, Duke level teams? One and they made ISU's only real Elite 8.

I just don't know where these ideas of grandeur come from. This year has sucked and CSP is ultimately responsible. Has his record and have his accomplishments been on par with the highest levels of ISU basketball's history? Maybe. Did Fred have more success at ISU? Sure.

I don't really have a problem with everyone wanting to get rid of Prohm, my issue is with everyone's unrealistic and unfounded expectations for CSP and the ISU men's basketball program in general. (Kind of like football last year.)
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Prohm's first team at ISU was legitimate. It was arguably the most talented team in ISU history.
 
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Macloney said:
What level is that?

In my lifetime, ISU has had ONE legitimate squad, the 99-00 Fizer team. That is it.

Decent teams, top 25 teams, better than a lot of teams? Sure.

ku, Kentucky, Duke level teams? One and they made ISU's only real Elite 8.

I just don't know where these ideas of grandeur come from. This year has sucked and CSP is ultimately responsible. Has his record and have his accomplishments been on par with the highest levels of ISU basketball's history? Maybe. Did Fred have more success at ISU? Sure.

I don't really have a problem with everyone wanting to get rid of Prohm, my issue is with everyone's unrealistic and unfounded expectations for CSP and the ISU men's basketball program in general. (Kind of like football last year.)
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"Unfounded Expectations"

It wasn't that long ago we had hit two 3 seeds, a 4, a 5, and a 6 and things were going well fan base wise for the most part even if there was some parts that were legitimatly disappointing like the meltdown the team had last year or Georges breaking his foot. Nobody is screaming we should be winning national titles. Over that time we competed with and beat a lot of the top tier programs. It's not like we play in the Sun Belt and there's a clear glass ceiling on us
 
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The Fizer/Tinsley team was the best. Those other teams were good but didn't have the depth and the ability to be as 'multiple' to be able to play against any kind of team. That Drake loss is still really baffling though. 44 points?

LE caught lightning in a bottle for that group but I also don't recall him having to talk over and over about how tough and mean his team needed to be; it was just what was expected. They didn't just beat UCLA in the Sweet 16, they embarrassed them.

That said if you watch a game from 2011-2017 compared to now, the general talent difference and talent working together is pretty stark.
 
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Macloney said:
What level is that?

In my lifetime, ISU has had ONE legitimate squad, the 99-00 Fizer team. That is it.

Decent teams, top 25 teams, better than a lot of teams? Sure.

ku, Kentucky, Duke level teams? One and they made ISU's only real Elite 8.

I just don't know where these ideas of grandeur come from. This year has sucked and CSP is ultimately responsible. Has his record and have his accomplishments been on par with the highest levels of ISU basketball's history? Maybe. Did Fred have more success at ISU? Sure.

I don't really have a problem with everyone wanting to get rid of Prohm, my issue is with everyone's unrealistic and unfounded expectations for CSP and the ISU men's basketball program in general. (Kind of like football last year.)
Click to expand...

I think after the mass exodus last season, if there was enough at ISU to put together an NIT team that was also within a few possessions of good teams, the mood would be different (not for everyone, but overall).

And I know that TH's injury officially nailed the season down, but the way things have gone and looked, it's maybe a difference of one or two wins.
 
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